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And Another One

Started by baratunde aka jack turner · 12 months ago

The Drudge Report is teasing an O’Reilly segment that has Jesse Jackson once again playing himself like only Jesse can. Audio obtained by FOX apparently has Jackson saying he would like to “cut Obama’s nuts out”. It’s Drudge though, so the tease might be misleading, except that Jackson himself has said:

Jackson ... Continue reading »

152 comments

  • I think that it's ok to criticize Barack Obama.

    But it's NOT okay to talk about cutting somebody's nuts off, or talking about somebody in a crude fashion like that.

    And I can't help but wonder, would Jesse Jackson have used such crude language to or about a white candidate who's ideology he disagreed with?

    The MSM playing this up is another part of the "Barack has no nutz" meme.
  • Well, if he has no nutz, then there's nothing for Jesse to cut off....therefore Jesse's comment is moot. LOL
  • Ha!

    Well to be correct he said cut his nuts out, which is just so much worse in my mind.
  • Apparently, NO, Jesse didn't learn from "Hymietown".

    It's time for him to make a graceful exit from the stage - he has run out and he doesn't have MLK's coattails to ride on anymore.
  • Andrew Sullivan isn't exactly a Barack supporter. Sure, he wanted him to win the nomination, but by his own admission, he's still open as to who he wants to be president. He respects McCain far more than I ever have and he's a libertarian conservative so he probably wants to endorse McCain, but McCain isn't giving him a lot of reason to.

    Besides, Sullivan can't vote, so...

    That said, maybe JJ did this on purpose.

    Just sayin.
  • Wasn't the FISA vote today? This silly story knocked it off he headlines. I'm kinda embarrassed by how gleeful Wolf and Campbell looked when they talked about how crude it was. LOL

    I've wanted to cut Wolf's nuts off a few times this week.
  • Wolf has nuts? Who knew?
  • Only this week, Truthseeker? You're a saint, then.

    LOL
  • Today is his first day back! ...HA
  • There's so much theater going on in this campaign, it's hard to tell fact from fiction.
  • I didn't know Wolf had any cajones. LOL
  • I can't stand Campbell Brown. She will twist words and is always pretending to be digging for the truth when she is only digging for the negative...usually on Sen Obama.
  • I see I'm not the only one who can't stand that nitwit. And, she is a condescending, race-baiting nitwit. Glad to see that someone else can see her blatant anti-Obama bias.
  • Me either!!!! So ta-rue!!!
  • I'm not sure how Jessie saying something rude in public relates to Obama distancing himself from "prominent black figures" but here's the Obama camp response:

    “As someone who grew up without a father in the home, Senator Obama has spoken and written for many years about the issue of parental responsibility, including the importance of fathers participating in their children’s lives. He also discusses our responsibility as a society to provide jobs, justice, and opportunity for all. He will continue to speak out about our responsibilities to ourselves and each other, and he of course accepts Reverend Jackson’s apology,” said Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton.
  • What does this response have to do with anything?
  • If I had to try to make sense of it...Jesse's comment was in response to Obama's speech about parental responsibility and participating in their child's live so Obama's camp was saying this message is nothing new , it's what he has always said and part of his view is shaped by growing up without his father. So whether Jessie cuts his nuts out our not he is still going to spread this same message. And if Jess is really apologizing then cool.
  • What kills me about Obama's "intelligence" is this:

    1.

    "parental responsibility and participating in their child's live"

    A man not being in the home mean that he is a deadbeat?

    Is this intelligent man really going to reduce a group of people to a statistic?

    2.

    If we are looking at numbers then the breakdown of the family is an American problem? Why make a speech were you stand up in a conservative blakc church and berate black people?

    He should have spoken to all American black, white, latino etc... but no the race neutral candidate made it a race specific problem.

    I have a problem with that, sorry.
  • He was speaking at a Black church. There is a real problem in the Black community of fathers abandoning their children Every one of my female cousins that are divorced have absentee fathers. I am not unique in our community.

    It is an American problem, but the incidence in Black families is higher. This is a fact we can only resolve by confronting. Do not have a problem with the truth.
  • So now Barack isn't even intelligent?

    Surely you jest.
  • 1) He did speck to all of America

    2) Here is the breakdown by race of the American problem:

    The nation's out-of-wedlock birth rate is 38%. Among white children, 28% are now born to a single mother; among Hispanic children it is 50% and reaches a chilling, disorienting peak of 71% for black children. According to the National Center for Health Statistics, nearly a quarter of America's white children (22%) do not have any male in their homes; nearly a third (31%) of Hispanic children and over half of black children (56%) are fatherless.

    So by shear numbers, yes it is an American problem. But if you are going to single out any race to make a point the one with alarming statistics may be the one that you reference in your speech.
  • Nellcote,
    I can't quite make the connection either. I just want to know who these prominent black leaderSSS are, because I only remember a leader. He distance himself from his pastor, which is really a personal situation.
  • I agree with your post, but let's not kid ourselves, it is part of the game, even though we hate it, that a large segment of the "majority" population does not like Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton. It's sad but true.

    What's funny is that I was just thinking a few weeks ago when all this FISA brouhaha started that it has been relatively quiet on the Al and Jesse front, even considering the Sean Bell incident, and the new Imus incident, it seems to me that "the Revs" were being pretty quiet. I figured that they were trying to keep a low profile so as to not be a "distraction" or "problem" for Obama's campaign.

    Well, there goes that line of thinking...
  • They both have been and Jackson was caught off guard. He should have known better.
  • Jesse Jackson JR via the LA Times:

    His comments triggered condemnation from an unexpected source: Rep. Jesse L. Jackson Jr. (D-Ill.), Jackson's son.

    In a statement released by his office, Jackson Jr. said he was "deeply outraged and disappointed in Rev. Jackson's reckless statements about Sen. Barack Obama."

    "His divisive and demeaning comments about the presumptive Democratic nominee -- and I believe the next president of the United States -- contradict his inspiring and courageous career," the congressman said.

    "Rev. Jackson is my dad and I'll always love him," he said. "He should know how hard that I've worked for the last year and a half as a national co-chair of Barack Obama's presidential campaign. So I thoroughly reject and repudiate his ugly rhetoric. He should keep hope alive and any personal attacks and insults to himself."
  • Have mercy.
  • Yeah!...."He should keep hope alive"?? He's pretty mad to say this about his father!
  • Craig,
    Say it again.
    I was clutching my chest when I first heard Jesse Jr.'s statement.
    But it just let me know that Jesse Sr. has been picking all along in private and in public.
  • Craig: Yep!
  • if we can go a year without anyone saying "i reject and repudiate" anything, it will be true heaven.
  • Keep hope alive??
  • Good lord!
  • I just saw the clip on O'Reilly. And I hate O'Reilly so it pained me to tune in and I gotta ask, what the hell was Jessie thinking? Why would you say something like that at all much less in the Fox studios? It's gonna be played over and over again. It's one thing to say you feel Obama talks down to black people (the first part of the statement), some here have said the same thing. And you can spin that if needed. But you can't claim "misspeak" when you say you want to cut his nuts out. That's just stupid.

    And now O'Reilly is saying there is more which is even worse that they didn't play out of respect (?) to Jessie.

    Sighhh!
  • Hannity said he's going to play the whole tape on his show.
  • Well hopefully other news organizations pick it up because I can not stand Hannity at all. And no matter how bad I think the situation is I am sure Hannity will make it 100% worse.
  • I don't think anyone get any points here.

    Many believe in faith based initiatives, many black folks totally agree with Barack on parental responsibility.

    The one who lose points is Jesse Jackson. He really need to chill.

    And if they had more to play, which will come out, I can bet my paycheck that is a on Jesse, not Barack.
  • I did not like Obama's speech and I felt that it was talking down. I agree with parental responsiblity because who does not but that as I keep repeating was not the reason why some do not appreciate Obama's speech....hello!
  • I didn't like Obama's "speech" either. Still don't.
  • "Cut his nuts out".....that's such an odd phrase.
  • It's particularly odd coming from a black man who knows that lynching often involved cutting a black man's nuts out.

    And O'Reilly is the one who called for a lynching party on Michelle if she really hates her country.

    If Barack loses enthusiasm from black voters, he loses the election.

    Father's Day was last month. So we're still talking about it a month later because Jesse Jackson put his foot in his mouth?
  • Yeah, & it's double weird coming from a "reverend." There are some crunk men of God coming out of Chi this year! Thank goodness that politics is off limits at work, or whie co-workers would be asking, "Does your paster ever cuss? Does s/he cuss during the sermon? Does s/he talk about privates? Does s/he talk about cutting privates? What kind of preacher talks about cutting privates? Do you think it's ok for preachers to cuss and talk about cutting privates?"

    SHUUUUT UUUUUPPPPP!!!!!!!!!!!
  • And any Dem that goes on Fox should assume their mike is live until they leave the damn building!
  • You must have been listening to the same radio show I was listening too..that's what tha callers said..LOL
  • Agree with Nellcote.

    And I'm for one tired of irresponsible black fathers getting this knee jerk protection from the community. We talk about this problem all the time but the minute Obama says it and he should get his "nuts cut off"? Obama NEVER said ALL black fathers are irresponsible in their duties. He is addressing the ones that need to be addressed. Why is it ok to discuss the problems of other segments of the population but not the black men that don't take any part in their children s lives?

    And Jessie Jackson has father illegitimate children so I would rather get my moral judgments else where.
  • Obama is not a preacher, or community leader. Obama is a presidential candidate. For a Presidential candidate, the subject of missing fathers is inappropriate except in very broad, non-racial terms. It is a social problem, better dealt with by social leaders. Obama can only appropriately address this issue from the standpoint of policy...jobs, education, social programs etc.

    I am surprised that anyone advised him to take this route.
  • I knew it would happen, but I totally disagree with you.

    But I still love you. ;)
  • Damn, just when I had recovered from that speech.
  • It's hard out here for a pimp. LOL

    I'm 'bout to make you some chow chow.
  • It's hard out here for a pimp.

    Oh Craig..

    BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
  • Aint it though. I need that chow chow, it's been years.
  • Obama is doing this to dispell the myth that "all" blacks have no sense of personal responsibility. You can't call for governmental help in poor neighborhoods without addressing some of the problems--one of the problems is absent fathers. Does an absent father mean a child will grow up to be a criminal? No. But it doesn't help an already tough situation.
  • No he is perpetuating it. If he wanted to "dispell" it he would have made a positive speech about the many men who are never mentioned ever. He chose the usual rhetoric.
  • How is he perpetuating it by addressing it? His speech is not going to be the cause for the problems that affect the black community to continue nor the myth to be spread wider. He may have highlighted it but I don't see how her perpetuated it.
  • Lots of children are SAVED from not knowing their fathers. Children who are abused by their fathers, are abused by the fathers who stick around. What are the statistics of present, abusive fathers?
  • So true, girl, so true!
  • He was at a Black church. His father abandoned him. He lived in a community of Blacks where some fathers abandoned children. How could he not speak about it. Most Black men that are taking care of their families talk about this problem.

    I do not understand why this issue is off limits to any, but avid racist. All folks who want the Black community to thrive should bemoan the high incidence of father abandonment in the Black community.
  • There are a lot of issues pertinent to blacks. I could have pulled a bunch of cliches out my ass and given the same speech...if I didn't fundamentally respect my audience. This issue is talked about ad nauseum by preachers and people sitting on porches and women in fancy hats in congregations...It's not off-limits. What has changed now that Barack has talked about it, except that bigoted, blue collar whites got a tingle?
  • Maybe it will resinate more if it is said by a black man who overcame a lot of obstacles to become the probable President of the United States. That's powerful. And while we can appreciate the porch sitters, big hat wearers and preachers if they are in similar circumstances they can and have been ignored. But this man is about to be the leader of the free world. If he can't have an impact or at the very least speak out to a crowd and have his message resinate with young men then well thats too bad. As a child of a single parent home (Barack, not me) if he didn't it would be ignoring a huge segment of the population who may need a new inspiration. And the message is not on that needed to be exclusive to black men but all men and if you listen to it again it did address all men not living up to their responsibility.
  • The racial dog whistle goes both ways.
  • Huh???
  • Barack's speechifying on this issue isn't going to change a damn thing. I'm not trying to be nasty, but it is wishful thinking to believe that Barack's voice will suddenly show some wayward man the way.

    I believe in Barack, and I think that he will be good for the country in many ways. However, all the lectures in the world are not going to fix poverty or drug addiction or crime, the main factors that challenge low-income families.

    He knows this of course, and that's key, because to me, it says that he is only using his lectures to Black people to score political points with Whites.
  • I respectfully disagree. Mostly because he is not lecturing.

    I do known his speech is not going to change everyone but it may bring about a different discussion. I would much rather hear the words he said come out of his mouth (as someone raised without his mother) then the poster boy for nuclear family, George Bush.

    I refuse to believe that Barack woke up in the morning, kissed Michelle ad the girls and said it's time to sacrifice the black man to appease whitey. Maybe if he was making up a situation that didn't exist and he wasn't personally familiar with then sure I'd be skeptical. But he was speaking to a major issue that affected him and affects families across race and class.
  • "I refuse to believe that Barack woke up in the morning, kissed Michelle ad the girls and said it's time to sacrifice the black man to appease whitey."

    I'm sure he just clenched his jaw, went out there and took care of business. Barack is a grown man with children of his own...I don't believe it is personally cathartic for him to talk about his own missing father on the stump.
  • Truthseeker,
    I mean this in a sisterly loving way but, says who?
    That is what alot of people of all races talk about.
    Divorced fathers slack off, unmarried fathers slack off. If 70% of black children are born out of wedlock and 55% of all marraiges end in divorce then it is a valid point. It is a national crisis.
    Where is this legislation that states that Senator Barack Obama can't talk about personal responsibility and government policy, jobs, education, social programs etc.
    in the same speech, LIKE HE DID ON FATHER'S DAY?
  • The economy is dependent on marriage - a religious institution - to provide for children. When the religious institution collapses, the government must find ways to support single parents. The only way Barack can effectively address this, is from the standpoint of the economy. When he starts preaching about missing fathers, he's doing what has always been done to no effect...he is pandering to a group. He is far too smart to not know the dynamics at play.

    He knows talking about it is ineffective, and the only power he has to change it is in policy; however, he didn't speak on policy to that audience. Barack's speech is not going to make missing fathers suddenly care. Tired cliches - "too many fathers are AWOL" , "too many fathers are MIA"...c'mon! - are not going to do a thing except please the cheering section of bitter, blue collar whites who think that black people are oversexed and irresponsible.....and angry, abandoned black women.

    Oh, he can talk about it. But I can also know that he's being a little weasel.
  • Word (1990's). For real.

    Do we really need a lecture from Obama? How is this Presidential? Isn't this the same shit we've been hearing since the 1980's from Republicans? How has it worked for us?

    I am sick of Black people demonizing other Black people, as if we created dysfunction. It is insulting and condescending when anyone uses a lecture to Black people as a political touchstone for Whites.

    If Obama wants to fix absentee father-ism, he might want to start with the fact that a hundreds of thousands of them are in jail. It's hard to parent from a jail cell.

    This election has truly re-awakened me to the deep racism in America. Obama has to become the mouthpiece of the paternalistic white person, telling Black people how awful he thinks we are, in order for him to be taken seriously. White people can't say it because they'd be deemed racist, so Obama and Bill Cosby have to say it for them.
  • Uhm what?

    Marriage is a religious institution? Except that atheists get married.

    When the marriage collapses the government must support the single parent? But what about the father/mother. Just because the relationship doesn't last the child is still here and should be cared for by both parents, emotionally and financially. The government should be a last extreme result.

    I don't understand. It's not an economic message it's take care of your children. Doesn't matter what race or religious affiliation (or lack their of). You brought it into the world, take care of it until you or it leaves the world (and there are some cases when you just can't ,like illness or abuse, and that is what the government is there, or should be there, to help with).

    There would be no need for tired cliches if some part of what he was saying is true.
  • Some Atheists even exchange gifts at Christmas. :)

    "Just because the relationship doesn't last the child is still here and
    should be cared for by both parents, emotionally and financially."


    Says who? That's one of many social mores. But humans have a funny way of disobeying rules. Obama's vain speech changed nothing for those who disobey the social rules, and he knew it.

    "The government should be a last extreme result"

    I think of government as representative of the collective. It's not in
    the collectives best interest to have children uncared for.

    'I don't understand. It's not an economic message it's take care of your
    children. Doesn't matter what race or religious affiliation (or lack
    their of). You brought it into the world, take care of it until you or
    it leaves the world"


    If it's not an economic message, then what type of message is it? Is it a moral message; if so, based on what? Maybe it's based on an idea of what's right. But how do we determine what's right, based on what criteria? What if that parent decides that it's not right for them?
  • Wait. Huh? I am totally confused by this statement: "When the religious institution collapses, the government must find ways to support single parents." I totally disagree. Instead of more government intervention in our lives we need less. Historically, when people needed help making ends meet, they got another job, or made sacrifices in other areas. And kept it moving. Government assistance should be the last resort, i.e. in case of emergencies only.

    And to address your responses below, the government does represent its citizens, but we in should no way be looking for it to take care of our children. It's about proper planning. And where is the money going to come from to sustain these programs? I honestly think that within the next 10 years or so, a lot of these programs are going to be cut altogether, which should give plenty of people an incentive to take initiative.
  • Is it really good for the collective for a parent to work more than 8 hours per day? What happens when the collective feels the effect of a child who's been ignored by a parent? A needy child is an emergency.

    You say "it" in reference to goverment as if it forms an entity of it's own, with it's own rights that need to be protected. I say "us" in reference to government. Government is a tool.

    As for program funding...all it takes is will. You've waged a 5 year war in a sovereign country that was not a threat. The Iraq war has lasted longer than the 2nd world war. There was a will to invade Iraq.
  • I'm not going to make generalizations about everybody's else's situation, but my Mom worked more than eight hours a day, and I turned out just fine. Would I have liked if she worked less? Of course. But she doesn't agree with taking handouts from anyone, especially since it means you might have to sacrifice some of your privacy and autonomy. And since she has always wanted children, she felt it was her job to do what needed to be done to sacrifice for them.
    So despite her long hours, what made the difference was good parenting. It's that simple. She taught me certain values at a young age, and I respected her authority. She was also vigilant when she needed to be, and made sure that I had good influences in my life.
    Now, if my father would have been present and active, things would have been different. She wouldn't have had to work as much to support my sister and I. But from here, I don't see where the government comes in.

    And as far as program funding, it might take a will, but it also takes money. And plenty of people are not happy that their paychecks are constantly being sliced and diced to support government programs. I think a total overhaul is needed, and some of these programs should be cut. And is the war really a good analogy? We are in a huge deficit right now because of it, and we are going to pass it on to our children.
  • Pass the deficit onto children, but no will to have invested that money into those same children in the first place. Had that investment taken place, the children would be more than equipped to handle the much smaller debt incurred. Instead, they will pay for what we haven't equipped them to handle.

    Your pay cheque pays for an unjust war. I don't hear a great outcry from Conservatives especially....the ones who are averse to taxes.

    The model they propose has been tried before. It was called the Dark Ages. The advent of government, social programs, unions, law enforcement, health care system, fire department, public school, has brought us to our present civilization.

    Now that we have reaped the benefit of that civilization, we look askance at the very institution that has made it possible: Government and taxation.

    Now that we've made it safely out of infancy, have gone to the schools that others have helped build (surely your parents tax dollars alone were not sufficient to educate you) we look suspiciously at taxes.

    It is meanness. Selfishness. Small-mindedness.
  • But I think that you are talking about the extreme of conservatism. Of course we need people's taxes to contribute to basic infrastructure and the security of this country, which everyone benefits from, but I think the argument is, we have gone way over the top with government programs and government involvement in our everyday lives. And with increased government programs, people have to pay for it in taxes. And I don't think its fair to simply attribute people's concern about increased taxes to meanness, selfishness, or small mindedness.

    Say for example, I wait to have children until I am married and have two incomes, or I am single with a significant income to support that child. And the next person doesn't make wise decisions, or fails to properly plan for a child, and then seeks government assistance in the form of food stamps, welfare, etc. when they can't make ends meet Many people feel that these types of programs are encouraging bad behavior. That instead of restraint, responsibility, and sound financial planning, people are getting themselves into situations that they are ill equipped to handle and then turning to government assistance to fill in the gaps (this is a generalization, I realize there are exceptions). So when people look at their situation, and understand that they made sacrifices to live comfortably, to simply say that it is selfish to expect someone else to do the same is short sighted. Yes, we live in a collective society, but ultimately we have to take care of ourselves.
  • "..but I think the argument is, we have gone way over the top with
    government programs and government involvement in our everyday lives.
    And with increased government programs, people have to pay for it in
    taxes. "


    That argument hasn't been made with supportive facts and evidence. So, it is more of a 'prejudice' rather than an argument. It's like saying black people are lazy ...but never providing measurement of their laziness in comparison to any other race. You already pay the taxes. The question is in how those taxes are utilized. I think there is a definite meanness component in Conservative ideology. They believe in punishment and shame as motivation for good behaviour.
    Not even the extremely wealthy are completely self-sufficient. They require infrastructure and the civilization it fosters in order to survive.

    "..And the next person doesn't make wise decisions, or fails to properly
    plan for a child, and then seeks government assistance in the form of
    food stamps, welfare, etc. when they can't make ends meet Many people
    feel that these types of programs are encouraging bad behaviour."


    It's in everyone's best interest to ensure that those people are fed and cared for. As a matter of fact, it's a bargain! If not, then that person will flounder, they may turn to crime, they may take someone's life, they may end up in jail. At each step, taxes will be used to bring them to justice, and punish them. It is far cheaper to provide food and housing. The problem is, that even food and housing is used to shame and punish the recipients. It is not the government's job to use the necessities of life to punish and mitigate "behaviour". It is the government's job to make sure we maintain our civilization and keep ALL people moving forward.

    "So when people look at their situation, and understand that they made
    sacrifices to live comfortably, to simply say that it is selfish to
    expect someone else to do the same is short sighted."


    It's short-sighted to preoccupy ourselves with what someone else does. There are bigger fish to fry. I don't care what choices they've made, I care that they have the opportunity to change course and move forward...whatever that takes. Maybe Conservatives need to acquire some wisdom and understanding to go with their prejudice and greed.
  • I think that we just have a fundamental disagreement on how the government should work.

    1) "You already pay the taxes. The question is in how those taxes are utilized. I think there is a definite meanness component in Conservative ideology. They believe in punishment and shame as motivation for good behaviour."

    First of all, I think that it is a generalization to say that there is a component of "meanness" in conservative ideology. How is it "mean" to expect people to take care of themselves? And again, I go back to the fact that people are well aware that they have to pay taxes to provide for infrastructure, security, etc. but many people do NOT want their tax money to go to programs that are enabling bad behavior, which they see as a dependent relationship on government assistance. I was focusing my comments on Black people, but this goes for everyone. And I will speak for myself. I don't want the money that I make at my job to go to someone who doesn't know how or doesn't try to take care of themselves. I guess that makes me mean, but that's fine.

    "Not even the extremely wealthy are completely self-sufficient. They require infrastructure and the civilization it fosters in order to survive."

    Of course no one is absolutely self-sufficient. But people just want to take it back to the basics, and not throw in a lot of social programs that are doing more harm than good.

    "It's in everyone's best interest to ensure that those people are fed and cared for. As a matter of fact, it's a bargain! If not, then that person will flounder, they may turn to crime, they may take someone's life, they may end up in jail."

    That's just the point. It's in YOUR best interest to make sure that you are fed and cared for NOT the government. I refuse to subscribe to the belief that people can just be lax and irresponsible in their personal decision making, but its okay because its in everyone's best interest that they land on their feet so we should just pitch in and help them out. Um no. We need to go to the root of the problem. And the root of the problem is that people need to make better decisions for themselves and take more initiative to invest in their future. If you feel that your schools are inadequate, form a group/organization and petition the school board/hang out in the library as much as you can/or move. If you feel that you need more money to live comfortably, look for ways to get training or more education or get another job. And if you can't afford to have children right away, either invest in sound birth control methods or abstain. These are things that individuals can do that have nothing to do with the government, but can change people's quality of life significantly.

    And when has poverty become an excuse for criminality? And how is that a bargaining chip? I should support these paternalistic social programs that I don't agree with, or these people may end up robbing/killing me later? Again, I think it shifts the argument to the wrong group of people. Instead of shaming others into thinking that it is their duty to take care of everyone in this way, we should be encouraging people to find ways to take care of themselves.

    "Maybe Conservatives need to acquire some wisdom and understanding to go with their prejudice and greed." This is another generalization. Just because many conservatives believe in self-sufficiency doesn't make them prejudiced. And just because people want to make sure the money in their pocket doesn't go to certain social programs doesn't make them greedy.

    But to sum up, I think we can agree to disagree.
  • His speech did include policy prescriptions.
  • micheline,

    Somehow no one heard that portion of the speech.
  • Sooooo, it is true that "people who live in glass houses[who procreate children in an EXTRA-marital situation] shouldn't throw stones [at a person who pointed this out when he wasn't even referring to him]."
    And is a REVEREND allowed" to say . . "cut his nuts out"? How is that SPIRITUAL GUIDANCE for the FLOCK????
    And his apology?? "IFI said anything . . . You did say something inappropriate and outrageous and you said it to the ENEMY!!!!!
    Mr. Jessie, Jr. was most appropriate in his disgust, denunciation and outright "BLAST" on the Rev!
    Whew!
  • Miss_Opinion: I forgot to co-sign in all my response. Sorry. :>) :>) :>)
  • I thought Jess had one child outside of his marriage, but I never got the impression that he left her hanging. He is too much of a public figure for that. They would extradite him from a foreign country during a hostage negotiation to arrest him for not paying child support & turn him into the dead-beat poster boy. I can't see him letting that happen.
  • But Jesse, for real, didn’t you learn your lesson about “private conversations” after Hymietown?

    LOL

    That just about says it all, dnA.

    of course, as some folks said on the radio..

    It's FOX NEWS.

    How could he trust until he was OUT of the building that ANYTHING he said wouldn't be used against him.

    Warren Ballantine tried his best on Stupid Campbell Brown's show. He's trying hard.
  • I just watched the O'Reilly Report and the comments were crude, "cut Obama's nuts off", but it was about his position on Obama's faith based initiative.

    Overall, no big deal. Barack is not losing the black vote, as Jesse said, and the good reverend need a cup of STFU, from here on out.
  • This is one of my many problems with Obama and his supporters. Yes, the old guard black leaders are out dated in a certain way but they have made it possible for Obama to be were he is today. His supporters and him to an extend take glee in the fact that his has distance from the black community.
  • Bingo vixen. What good is it going to do to have an African American President if all he's going to do is try not be an African American? The call it "First Blackitis" over at the Black Commentator.
  • How, exactly, is he trying not to be African American?
  • Listen to what Jesse said minus the nuts part pjamma. Jesse dissing
    Barack Obama is the gift that will keep on giving.

    I want to say this about black fathers and responsibility. I can count on one
    hand the number of fathers I know personally who aren't taking care of their
    children, Obama's father being one of them.
    I believe the number of responsible black fathers out number the slackers.
    I also believe the question should be asked why some fathers aren't being
    responsible. Is it because they are products of failing public schools and
    have no education nor skills? Is it because they have a felony record and
    can't find employment? Is it because the illegal immigrants are taking their
    jobs? It's easy to talk about what people are not doing, but that doesn't
    help the situation. Let's talk about solutions to the problem, not the problem.
  • But how does any of this have anything to do with Obama trying not to be African American? I don't think Obama ever said all black fathers are slackers. I know Obama never said he wanted to distance himself from the African American community and from what I know three of the biggest joys in his life are his African American wife and children. So maybe he says things that some people don't agree with but in no way does that make him less African American.

    When are we going to get over degrees of Blackness? My God, we are a huge diverse population and should not be judged of one mind. And no matter what you think of my, Obama or any other African American's opinion you and no one else in our community should be the judge of just how African American someone else is.
  • pjamma: Amen!
  • WTF. You thought he was going to be the black people's president?
  • It’s not that any one incident in and of itself doesn’t make sense, but the larger understanding of what his candidacy means in racial terms seems to be that his proximity to us as a people is a problem.

    I understand what you mean, but this isn't exactly a good example for that, dnA. Jesse bitchslaps him, on Fox News no less.....what's Obama supposed to do?

    I ask that in all honesty.

    I'm not about to get back into a debate about his Father's Day Speech. I agreed with it,and others didn't. I get that. Been there. Done that.
  • Sharpton and Steele on Hannity right now (yes I caved and turned it on).
  • you're braver than me.
  • Steele?

    LOL!!!!
  • Jesse Jackson should have talk to Obama personally if he had any beef with Obama. But, what does Jesse do instead the man goes and complains to a Foxnews reporter. Hell, Jesse should have just attended a Klan gathering to voice his opinions about Obama. Because all Fox News = Klux Klux Klan Network.

    No matter how much truth Jesse spoke about Obama he still did it on anti-Black news network. Jesse screwed up!
  • Mari19: YEP!
  • "I think that it's ok to criticize Barack Obama."

    "But it's NOT okay to talk about cutting somebody's nuts off, or talking about somebody in a crude fashion like that."

    -Town, that is a very cutting remark.
  • LOL
  • Sullivan's comments don't bother me. In no way does Sullivan demean black people in general or suggest proximity to black people is a problem.
  • So the Dan Abrams meme is that Jess'e remarks are PROOF that Barack is an elite snob.

    And Ronald Reagan, Jr. is calling Brad a fool.

    This is a circus!!!
  • Sigh. I've had this feeling for awhile now. One of Barack's biggest impediments to the presidency will not just be the Republicans, it will be people who claim to "support" him.

    Besides the obvious irony about Jesse Jackson getting upset about Barack's speech about absent Black fathers, can we keep it real for once? I get that many Black people don't like to be talked down to or used as fodder for racist White voters, but when will people start to openly admit, that the rampant irresponsibility by *some* Black men, AND women, is severely hurting our community. Despite what some may think, it is not a secret. And I just don't how you can separate this moral issue from the policy issues that are related to it. Yes, there are many single women kicking butt, taking names, and raising amazing children--my Mom being one of them--but I saw first hand how difficult it was.

    By bringing up children in that sort of environment, you are increasing the chances they will be raised in poverty (unless you have a significant amount of money to support yourself and a child), which will impact where they live, where they go to school, how soon you can advance in your career, and what type of health care both of you will have. So yes, this needs to be said. We can't bemoan the state of our schools, when parents have no active roles in reinforcing the importance of education at home, and are not aware of what is going on at the school. We can't bemoan the state of health care, when parents feed their children a steady diet of sugar and fat, and let them get obese, and we can't bemoan, our financial situations, when having children you can't afford significantly decreases your chances of being able to get advanced degrees/training/promotions, which will lead to better pay. It's about personal responsibility.

    Enough is enough. These young women and men, are having kids younger and younger now a days. Maybe we need to bring shaming back, or honor to the family. Because this is ridiculous. It has become so normalized to have single parent homes, that many do not blink an eye, but it continues to have a negative ripple effect that is just getting worse.
  • TRW, great post.
  • We admit it and many talk about it on a regular basis. I talk about it all the time. Trust me its spoken about and admitted!

    Obama did not invent this topic. In this case I believe that he was talking down to blacks and using us as fodder for racist white voters.
  • How, when he has been talking about this consistently? Why is everything about White voters? or White people? Maybe in the past yes, but now, not so much. I would rather hear Barack talk about these issues, as they relate to broader policy issues, because they are in fact relevant.

    We can agree to disagree but the biggest obstacles facing the Black community is not White racists, it is Black on Black crime, the income disparity, the high school drop out rates, AIDS, the deterioration of the Black family etc. I could go on. My point is most of these things we can control, but there seems to be a disconnect, and chaos within the community.

    These things need to be worked on internally by the Black community. The government can't do anything significant to solve these problems, and by Barack acknowledging it, doesn't automatically mean that he is trying to sell Black people down the river. Sometimes, the truth is the truth. And just because you speak about one truth, doesn't mean it applies to a whole group of people. If people can't figure that out, then that's sad.

    Also, yes, some Black people admit it and talk about it all the time, but it depends on which circles you run in. Other Black people are still looking to the government to single handedly fix the schools, housing, etc, when its not going to happen. It's just not. We need to take initiative instead of waiting it out for the government. I am basing this on my personal experiences, so I am obviously not speaking about everyone.

    I guess I am just frustrated about the things that I see everyday. It just seems like people don't have perspective. Instead of worrying about what White people think, we should be worrying about ourselves. I mean what happened to us? Our ancestors used to walk for miles, under the threat of violence from the KKK to get educated, and today it seems you couldn't pay some of these kids to crack a book. We used to value stable family relationships, and responsibility to the community, and now we have an increase in pregnant teenage mothers with absent fathers, young girls getting all kinds of STDs, and HIV rates that are disproportionate to other racial/ethnic groups. So, I want people to speak up loud in clear. These things are unacceptable, and until more people find them unacceptable, we are going to be stuck in neutral for years to come.
  • Booker T Washington had a good deal to say about facing uncomfortable race truths, the need to deal with white folks honestly and forthrightly (after all, it's not like white folks can't see it, too) and how many white folks, even though they are racists, want the best for their communities, which does involve the uplift of the black race. Perhaps Obama is following Mr. Washington's footsteps and not Jesse's or Al's. See:

    http://docsouth.unc.edu/fpn/washeducation/washi...
  • Sorry, and I meant to add, no, Obama didn't invent this topic, but is that what should disqualify him from speaking on it? I don't get that logic. Especially since he has shared his own experiences about what the absence of his father meant in his own life.
  • TRW, I think I love you.
  • Thanks :)
  • I just gave you a standing ovation. Thank you for saying exactly what should have been said in exactly the right way.
  • TRW: I just joined the STANDING O!!! Thanks!!!
  • So he can talk openly about war, healthcare, education, border issues, immigrants (who are mostly mexican), religion, rural folk, but when it comes to the one group and experience he is most familiar with, parenting and the lack of of paternal figure specifically as a black man in America it is off limits because it hurts people feelers? And even though the majority of the speech did not focus on the black community but the society as a whole, if he does address personal responsibilty it is all about dissing the black folk for the white voter? WTFever.
  • As if the emasculation of black men in America needed more assistance.
  • I think "we" are really over-analyzing this event...the mainstream-"caucasian" population probably feels sympathy for *O* right now. Nobody (at least no man) wants to comtemplate being made a eunuch.

    If Jesse had said, "Let's cut America's nuts off," ala Jeremiah Wright, then there would be REAL trouble.
  • Link to video of what Jesse Jackson Said:
    http://www.myfoxwfld.com/myvoicedc/2008/07/09/j...

    Jackson's press conference in full:
    http://www.myfoxwfld.com/myvoicedc/2008/07/09/j...
  • "So the Dan Abrams meme is that Jess'e remarks are PROOF that Barack is an elite snob."

    -Can you give more info on this (I'm watching BBC America right now, not Dan Abrams)?
  • The Republican strategist is saying that Jesse Jackson, who said that Barack was talking down to black people, provides proof that Barack is an elite snob.

    It's not just a white thing anymore, you see.
  • Craig,

    I don't even know what your voice sounds like, but reading this, I can almost hear the tone.

    I'm feeling you.
  • rikyrah,

    I've been doing a lot of "yawning" at so many of the comments in this thread.

    If Barack were the first major party candidate for president who happened to be Jewish, I wonder how many Jewish Americans would be attacking him from all sides and wanting to cut his nuts off.

    Just saying.
  • Or which fellow Jew would say:

    "I want to gas him up."


    I'm thinking zero, actually.
  • Well..........from the looks of what I saw in that Access interview yesterday, Jesse got some work on his hands.
  • msmartin,

    you.are.so.bad.

    LOL
  • I couldn't resist rikyrah.
  • ooohhhh you are so wrong for that one ms martin
  • I ain't saying nothing.
  • Some of you guys are like basic. It is about time and place and the way in which something is framed.

    Also are any of you aware of the study that was widely circulated in Newsweek?
  • Which one? Please share.
  • "like basic."

    Please define your terms.
  • Obama is getting critiized...and he should be.

    I tried to bring up Obama's disingeneousness before today

    Angela
  • What I didn't say earlier is that Obama is getting "creamed" more by is "own" than any other group........."what gives"
    Angela
  • What i think is so sad, so very sad, is that what other people say (Wright, Jesse Sr) has more significance with the MSM than what Obama says. It is so apparent they are trying to paint him with a sweep of the easiest brush instead of acknowledging the complexities of society, a cpmplexity that Obama has repeatedly acknowledges lives in him. Religion, values, culture and whatever seems to be the easiest way to pigeon hole this non white guy.

    Barack wasn't and isn't running to be the President of Black America. He isn't a spokesperson for ANY group. He is expressing who he is, which as far as I can tell is consistent with words he has chosen to describe himself. So I can find value in what he says, though I may not agree with it all. I can challenge his ideas while still having great respect for his willingness to speak when so many opt out.

    Jesse [insert Spanish expletives] was not a leader that I have EVER chosen. He occupies leadership role though many times he has chosen questionable and unethical paths. I KNEW he was a WACK supporter of Obama when Baratunde was on CNN... he half gave Obama his due. Remember they ate up so much time so Jesse could have a GRAND ENTRANCE [insert Spanish expletives.] Straight up, Jesse Jr just became a leader to the next generation. Jesse Sr is pan tostado.
  • evita: BIG TIME SI!!! Mad props to Jesse Jr.
  • "The Republican strategist is saying that Jesse Jackson, who said that Barack was talking down to black people, provides proof that Barack is an elite snob."

    "It's not just a white thing anymore, you see."

    -Thanks, CraigHickman.
  • I just watched the video that someone linked to here and to me it looked staged. It sounded like he said Obama was looking down on blacks with his faith-based initiatives and I didn't hear anything about the Father's Day speech. At any rate, it looked staged. Why in the hell would he be whispering while he's on the air?
  • If the he you are referring to is JJ he wasn't on air, he was off stage but his mic was still hot.
  • It was staged.

    And you're right, there was no reference to Father's Day in the clip.

    Didn't I say that both sides know how to wag the dog?
  • He's saying that because at least Obama is talking ACTION. For all the grandstanding Jesse does trying to live off MLK's back, what has he done for his "community" lately? I quite frankly do not care to hear about Obama's so-called pandering when these low lifes (Sharpton included) have gotten a free pass over the years. If Tavis Smiley had said the same thing Obama said word for word, he would have received nothing but a standing ovation. It is not about what Obama said, it is the fact that HE said it. Some people are still stuck on this "not black enough" and are too coward to come out and say it.
  • Agreed. This just goes back to what happened when Barack first started running. Andrew Young, another MLK Lieutenant, made several inappropriate--no scratch that, ignorant remarks about Obama. He pointed out how Obama didn't have many Black advisers around him, while Hillary did--which I guess qualifies you to care about Black people or Black issues, i.e. proximity to Blackness, he then went on to agree with Toni O's statement that Bill Clinton, was America's first Black president, and wait--"Bill is every bit as Black as Barack. He has probably gone out with more Black women than Barack." Yup, he was marching right along with MLK. I'm sure MLK would be beaming with pride.

    So, I'm with you. I call bull. Jesse Jackson can talk out of both sides of his neck about cutting off nuts and unequivocal support all he wants, but his comments (and other old guard civil right activists' comments) reveal that he is an egomaniac that refuses to acknowledge the changing landscape in America.
  • TRW: Andrew Young made the "Hater Watch" on blacks4barack. Also, Toni Morrison of "Bill as 1st Black Prez " fame, apologized for that very remark! She is endorsing Mr. Obama - also on blacks4barack.
  • Ok. That's fine. And now Jesse has apologized for his statements. My point is that these people should know better. People should think before they open their mouths.
  • Thank you!
  • Quanli: AGREED! I saw a recent Tavis interview with[I forgot who]. The person was giving mad props to Mr. Obama and tavis kept ignoring them! He just couldn't form his mouth to say 1 positive thing! It was patently obvious that he had his HATE ON during the whole interview!
  • "...the race neutral candidate made it a race specific problem." That statement from someone here expresses the essence of my problem with Mr. Obama. He is not a Black community leader. I'm disgusted at the idea of him lecturing us, advising us, or speaking for us. He is a politician still desperately in pursuit of white votes. When he talks about problems we face, instead of examining us, he should be talking about what institutional racism and the system are doing to our families and communties across this nation.
  • I guess you don't read. Because Barack has written quite a bit about these things.
  • And I disagree. What do you look for in a community leader? I look for someone who no matter what the obstacles went to one of the best collages in the nation, one of the best law schools in the nation, distinguished himself as one of the top in his class as editor of the law review, met and married a woman of a similar background who had similar achievements, made a whole lot of mistakes, including drugs, but admitted to it and spoke honestly about it, turned down corporate job offers to go back to his community as an advocate, became a state Senator, a US Senator, has two beautiful daughters, no affairs we know of, is positioned to be the next President of the United States and the biggest thing we as part of the black community can call him out on (based on the number of posts I've seen) is the fact he gave a speech about parental responsibility in a black church?

    I don't know what more you are looking for or what more you want him to be but I personally think he is someone I want the younger people in my family to look up to as a leader and as someone to emulate.
  • pjamma: WELL SAID!!!! Thanks!
  • This is exactly what happens when folks like Rev. Jackson refuse to take a principled pubic position regarding a candidate for public office because they want access to that candidate if he or she is elected to office. If Jackson objected to Obama's Fathers Day peroration then he should have said so publicly instead of ducking and dodging. I have made my objections to that speech quite clear to my friends and acquaintances. I also attended an Obama fundraiser this evening; paid my money like everybody else and ate fried fish, collard greens and corn bread. I had a good time. I will never like Obama's Fathers Day speech and I don't intend to bite my tongue about it.

    Suck it up, Rev. Jackson and be a man!
  • i thought the obama campaign's response to this incident was principled and decent. it was in no way a "distancing" of barack from jesse jackson. he accepted his apology and moved on. i also don't think that overall obama has distanced himself from all things black...actually, to the contrary... the issues he plans to address and correct as president have disproportionately negative impacts on black communities (he mentions this)...so i don't get it. i appreciate the fact that we have the VERY REAL possibility of having a president who is not only AWARE of "our" issues, but who intends to address them! how is that distancing? our marriage rates HAVE plummeted...we DO need to address the childrearing issue. these things are FACTS. his father's day speech (and other occasions where he's raised these issues) may be uncomfortable for some to hear, but we need to "get over" the discomfort and start the very hard work of healing.

    that's my humble opinion. this is my first time reading this blog.
  • "we DO need to address the childrearing issue. these things are FACTS. his father's day speech (and other occasions where he's raised these issues) may be uncomfortable for some to hear, but we need to "get over" the discomfort and start the very hard work of healing."

    Obama is not running for the presidency of Black America. The Black Electorate has no such position in its ranks. If elected president, he will not be Soul Brother No. 1. If he is still feeling any angst caused by his own father's behavior then he needs to address those issues in the privacy of a therapeutic relationship. If he wants to address absentee fathers as a public policy issue, then he should discuss it in the context of it being an American problem, not a Black American problem.
  • Correct. Obama is not going to be Soul Brother No. 1. All the more reason for black folks to push him hard on his policies before he is elected.

    Obama and McCain have both committed to total amnesty (with a token "back taxes" payment of maybe $3000 - chump change) of illegals and to letting them stay in America and keep working AND to bring their families here.

    This is going to be a devastating blow to our already overburdened now-multilingual school systems, welfare systems, and medical systems.

    Obama, as a member of the Democratic Party (which 40 years ago was the working class party) can probably be worked on better than McCain. And he should be.

    As Booker T. Washington explained, America has a duty to black folks and ought to "cast down its bucket" right here in the black community rather than inviting aliens of questionable (or no) loyalty to this country. See:

    http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/88.

    Which also has a recording of Mr. Washington giving that portion of his speech in Atlanta,1895.



    Mexicans are not going to stop sneaking illegals into the USA and protecting them.
  • you clearly misunderstood my comments. i am thoroughly aware (and grateful) that barack obama isn't running as the black people's president. and...you conveniently left out the part where i wrote that these issues have a DISPROPORTIONATELY negative impact on black (and brown) communities. that--in my view--is the key piece of this, and probably why barack feels comfortable in discussing it. frankly, it would be irresponsible of him NOT to. i'm very sensitive to black people being painted in a pathological light, as it's been done by so-called "social scientists" before in attempts to justify punitive public policy. however, i've listened to barack's speeches/rallies/etc. and i feel that he's treated the topic in a respectful, positive way.

    issues of privacy notwithstanding (and i daresay any person abandoned by their father probably always owns a little "angst") , it's about time that parental responsibility gets a national stage. sweeping it under the rug has not worked well.

    an aside: reading about your fundraiser made me HUNGRY!!!
  • This stuff is like watching a freaking perverse minstrel show with Bill Oreilly as rhe interlocutor
  • i think coming from a Rev who cheated on his wife and produced a child his assuption of Obama is hypacritical especially when he uses the term moral. i lost respect for Jesse Jackson sin he smeared Martin Luthers blood on himself and lied and said Martin Luther died in his arms. He is an opportunist of the worst kind as his own son said sit down and KEEP HOPE ALIVE.
  • Jesse demonstrated in Jenna regarding lynching. Black men were castrated also how may tell can an advocate of civil rights use that term so blatenly its just as bad as another black using the n work when refering to another black. Jesse may be you are suffering from dementia. And as for fathers responsibility i am one who constantly stay in family court trying to get assistance from my baby daddy and he will not work in order to not pay child support. what obama missed was acculades to the women that are fathers when he made that speech in addition to honoring those men that are because we do have them. but dont let the media define who we are by dividing and concuring us in an attempt to distance us from Obama that we stay home and dont vote. read between the lines the media is hard at work.VOTE VOTE VOTE DONT LET DOWN THE ONES THAT DIED FOR US TO HAVE THIS PRIVILIGE
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