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SO why does she feel calling herself "Hispanic" is not as limiting as Obama being called "Black?"
Hell, WE all know Blacks in this country have a mixed heritage...we see it in our own families...even Henry Louis Gates, Jr documented the genelogical finds of Oprah Winfrey, Mae Jemison, and T.D. Jakes, Chris Rock, Chris Tucker and others...and they all walked away with mixed heritage.
By Dahleen Glanton and Stacy St. Clair | Tribune Reporters
December 1, 2008
A slave cabin at the Friendfield Plantation
Five cabins remain today of the row of shacks that lined the dirt road once known as Slave Street on a South Carolina plantation. Michelle Obama's great-great-grandfather, who was born around 1850, lived as a slave, at least until the Civil War, on the sprawling rice plantation. (Tribune photo by Alex Garcia / November 22, 2008)
GEORGETOWN, S.C.—Tiny wooden cabins line the dirt road once known as Slave Street as it winds its way through Friendfield Plantation.
More than 200 slaves lived in the whitewashed shacks in the early 1800s, and some of their descendants remained here for more than a century after the Civil War. The last tenants abandoned the hovels about three decades ago, and even they would have struggled to imagine a distant daughter of the plantation one day calling the White House home.
But a historical line can be drawn from these Low Country cabins to Michelle Obama, charting an American family's improbable journey through slavery, segregation, the civil rights movement and a historic presidential election.
Their documented passage begins with Jim Robinson, Obama's great-great-grandfather, who was born around 1850 and lived as a slave, at least until the Civil War, on the sprawling rice plantation. Records show he remained on the estate after the war, working as a sharecropper and living in the old slave quarters with his wife, Louiser, and their children. He could neither read nor write, according to the 1880 census.
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Robinson would be the last illiterate branch of Michelle Obama's family tree.
Census records show each generation of Robinsons became more educated than the last, with Michelle Obama eventually earning degrees from Princeton University and Harvard Law School. Her older brother, Craig, also received an Ivy League education...
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-ob...
So... Obama may have never been connected to American slavery...
But his children are.
BWA HA HA HA HA HA
I thought that was frigging hilarious when it was revealed.
Can't escape American's ORIGINAL SIN, no matter where you go...LOL
"We are racially sophisticated enough to elect a non-white president, and we are so racially backward that we insist on calling him black."
"Insist on calling him black"........."insist".........
The only decent rebuttal to this woman is a slap across her face.
You highlighted the exact lines that I found so sickening. Thank you!
It's amazing, isn't it? Latinos are so in denial about their own racism. The only time you see Afro-Latinos on the Spanish language channels is as slaves, satan worshippers and/or servants. When Afro-Latinos can get on-air jobs on Telemundo, Univision....etc. instead of looking to BET for a gig, then Arana and her ilk can speak. Until then SIT DOWN.
"THAT NIGGER DID IT."
The author is an ass. The Latino community has it's own divisions of class. My grandmother came from the lowly poor and you saw in her a woman who was more native. Who even knows if she had conquistador blood. The novellas and any Mexican born stars are good looking in the white America way. They do not look as if they have any blood from indigenous people.
I find it sad that some feel as if the heavy lifting has only been done by blacks. I do feel that until America treated the black population with the respect and esteem it so richly deserves, there would be no real movement at all. There would be no real change for any of us, Sikh, Native, Latina, Asian....any of us without America stepping out of its denial.
It has been good for me to read.
I'm glad you said this. Sometimes I think people, especially immigrants don't realize that blacks in the country have taken a lot of the hits to make it easier for a lot of people who have been marginalized. But I do relaize many have done heavy lifting for the cause.
Cesar Chavez comes to mind...
It's esp galling for Latinos/Hispanics who have a complicated ethnicity and usually don't want to admit they have ANY African heritage even when they look "Blacker" than the average Black person. So that rejection is about "us" being at the bottom of the barrel. If everyone was doing really in well they'd be claiming it for sure. And yes Telemundo and Univision just kill me with them ALWAYS showing the whitest skinned people ever. Even Hollywood does it.
Did I mention the racism of a lot of Latinos who look down on Black people. Pu-leeze! Doesn't Brazil has the largest Black population outside continental Africa? When do we ever hear about the contributions of Afro-Latinos? And some native Mexicans who are Black? Where was all of this claiming then?
Besides Barack says he's Black and he has the right to self-determine how he views himself. I also think him being raised by whites was the best thing for him. He chose a regular Black woman as his mate, a woman who would've been passed over by a lot of Black men (whether they were educated/high salaried or not) who would've wanted a white woman just because they have one. Let's be blunt shall we. He also doesn't have this "I'm a victim of racism poor me for not achieving anything" mindset either.
Yes, yes my father has traced his family to West Africa as well as Sephardic Jews on the Iberian Peninsula, but he called himself BLACK. His choice. Period.
Growing up, my father and grandmother taught me about many black Cubans. (If she wasn't the absolute bomb, the Hispanic community would never claim Celia Cruz!)
But would you believe it wasn't until last year that I learned of the blacks in Mexico??? How ignorant I felt. Then I ran to tell my Mexican co-worker...he didn't know of them either.
When Malcolm X gave a lecture in Ghana, he was asked by a listener why he called himself black, since he was so light skinned than in Ghana he would be considered white. Malik responded: “At home, that is the place I was born, I’ve been called by Whites a yellow nigger, a light-skinned nigger, a red uppity nigger, a fair-skinned seditious nigger, but never until now have I been called a White man. I mean, Whites, who should know their own have never made the mistake of overlooking my African blood.”
Posted by Chris Van Dyke
LOL @ WTF do you think Black folk are?
That's what I'm saying...
History will not recoil that only black men could make America rise up and be true to her ideals and Consittuion...don't you see? white folks had something to do with this awesome brilliant man with his staggering leadership and political skills.
He ain't just black you see...he is white too...like them...and they say it with PRIDE!
that Black folk are the TRUEST Americans, because WE are the ones who have FOUGHT FOR this country to live up to its ideals. To put practice behind the words.
Great ideas have a million authors and failures are orphans, lol
I am with you ALL the way.
Frederick Douglass 4th of Jully address is one of my all time favorites.
No one, but slaves and former slaves, had as much reason to believe in this countries ideals. Everybody else had it handed to them and they take it for granted. Only black folks and jews understand persecution, and are staunch defenders of civil rights and Constitutional freedoms.
I have come to believe that black people are the only people in this country capable of forcing America to live up to the ideals she herself put forth. Every other group will shuck and buck and go along with the program until black people spill their blood and force the system to work the way it's supposed to, then they swoop in and reap the rewards.
you said this months ago, about why every other group needed to be on OBama's train. Black folk do all the heavy lifting, working, being the battering ram on the door, and after the door's busted down, then EVERYBODY ELSE wants to clamor on in, knowing damn well, they didn't lift shit.
Heartsandflowers, I totally agree that Black women should keep their options open but the timing of these ads and the fact that I have only seen ads with White men with Black women makes me suspicious.
I'm a bit disconcerted by the emphasis on Black women with White men, though. Not that there's anything wrong with it. But it does make me go "Patriarchy much?"
I'm all for keeping my options open - spend time outside this country, and you see for yourself; AMERICA is the only country that has problems seeing interracial couples as just THAT - COUPLING.
And Brothas in Europe look at sistas in similar fashion as Brothas in the States; no real difference.
I was more disgusted with that VOGUE cover featuring LeBron James with that "ape" looking smile on his face with Heidi Klum - however, Heidi looked comfortable with it because she's married to Seal.
And the way Heidi talks about Seal, you would think she just discovered the male sex, PERIOD.
My experience has been that sistas sell out just as much as brothas when they date outside the race.
I must say that I find that sistas have a glaring double standard when it comes to interracial dating. We tend to be more lenient when BW date outside the race, but when BM do it it's a whole 'nother story. Just reading some of the responses in this convo is proof of that. Can you imagine if BM were talking about how much white women were into them as opposed to BW? They would get slammed by us!
My own experience is that BROTHAS will talk major shyt when they see BWs with non-Black men, and have nerve enough to upbraid US for dating outside the race, even with their white girl on their arm.
I think we have unique experiences, regarding this, but I have yet to date outside my race - doesn't mean I'm not giving it strong consideration because in the end, I want a man who knows how to honor, treat and respect women; who knows how to be responsible for himself, and that I am not responsible for making him happy - it is about how our relationship enhances and enriches our lives in joint fashion. Now, if that quality man comes in a package that is not of the same race as my own, but comes in unconditional fashion, who's going to turn their back on that in order to be PC?
#1 husband was Black/Cherokee - 13 years
#2 White/Pennsylvania/Dutch German- 7 years
#3 Black-Jamaican/Canadian- 16 years
And they are all good! :-)))))
My raised eyebrow was at the fact that interracial coupling regarding Black women tends to always be with White men in these ads. Why not Black women and Latino men? Or Black women and Asian-American men, in fact, that would make more of an impact, my Asian-American male friends and I have the same conversations when it comes to interracial dating, they understand, trust that! The patriarchy in America isn’t “Men are the standard”, it is “White men are the standard”, Lorde’s mythical norm.
I've traveled extensively in Europe, so I know what you mean. I've gotten a lot of love from men in France, England and Scotland (I must admit, that one surprised me), but Italian men are a whole 'nother story! I remember feeling like the second coming of womanhood the way they were carrying on, lol! I have heard it's similar in Greece, but I've never been there, so I guess I'll see. I'm headed to Hungary next summer, so I'll have to see how Eastern Europe compares to Western Europe.
And that's when it came to me, I'm not feeling that love here in America. I agree with you in that while Black men and Black women are held to different standards when it comes to interracial dating, it's because we're held to different standards in almost every other area in terms of our humanity and desirability. All women are objectified in American culture, but Black women tend to be positioned at the lowest rank, and even then, it's as a toy and caricature of who we are in all our complexities.
I admit when I see Black men with White women, usually I ignore them. But if it's a sista, I'm giving her a "You go GURL!" smile or head nod.
I would much rather see ads featuring black men with black women, showing that yes, black men desire black women. That's what I love about Barack and Michelle Obama. Their relationship totally obliterates the myth that successful black men and women must seek white mates in order to find love and happiness.
Well heartsandflowers that's only if you are of the belief that dating white men is the solution to whatever problem you perceive BW are having in their romantic lives.
What is your definition of a "quality BM"?
We are always so quick to point to racism from whites but never acknowledge the Black on Black crimes that we've committed against each other. Look how Michelle Obama was treated and how some Black men have had the nerve to imply that Barack could've 'done better'. Has it not dawned on you the appeal a lot of us had for Barack was because of Michelle? Which only speaks of the fact that so many of us have been denigrated.
WHY DON"T YOU FOCUS ON THAT INSTEAD? Protecting and uplifting Black women and being your best instead of trying to argue symantics because YOU FEEL THREATENED. We don't know each other and if you were being all you could be you would've let this go a long time ago. I could care less about your protests and requests for conditions.
My definition of a quality man is mine and mine alone. Every woman is different. Why don't YOU DEFINE WHAT A QUALITY BLACK MAN IS? But if you are really interested in getting some real knowledge and a reality check you are free to check out wonderful teaching essays from http://blackwomenblowthetrumpet.blogspot.com and http://www.blackfemaleinterracialmarriage.com
Otherwise this entire conversation is moot and BS because you're just pissed off to hear about women making their own choices that go against your narrow little world!
I think that BW feel any BM is better than no BM AT ALL, and I'm not buying it. I'm not into sharing and when Audrey Chapman wrote that book about sistas settling for sharing married Brothas instead of broadening their horizons, I wanted to throw up because Dr. Chapman was appearing to advocate for sistas being mistresses to another sista's husband.
All I saw was the brotha got benefits; two women he could screw on the regular and one he didn't have to commit to.
I think BW are royalty and we deserve to be treated as such; therefore, when we hold ourselves out as queens, our Prince will step to us, and if he's in another flavor, you will know he's stepping correct.
I'd like a quality brotha, but I am willing to wait for a quality MAN. PERIOD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBq87dbKyHQ
The focus has been on white men because the initial post was about the sudden surge of BW-WM couplings, to which you said it was simply showing black women that we have "options". IMO, your posts were also implying that if black women start dating interracially, it would solve their relationship problems, which is simply untrue.
I do agree that quality is important and BW should look for men from all backgrounds, including black men with blue collar backgrounds, but when you suggest that to some sistas they look upon it as "settling".
My greatgrandfather was what would be considered "Chinese Jamaican" so that kind of thing is not new for me. Mostly all of my friends are black with last names like Chung due to this. Many West Indians have those mixtures especially where my mom is from in JA where all of her close friends were Asian.
Whew! Was I ever glad when I got to the sentence..you can read the rest of this tripe at...I was like WTF up until then...no rikyrah did NOT write this.
You are so dead right after that sentence when you commenced to 'breaking it down'
But I want you to know, that Harold Ford does not have any wavy hair AT ALL, in fact those tightly individually coiled strands (colloquially called naps) on his head are what scream BLACK. & why he keeps that hair closely cropped.
In terms of why Obama chose Michelle. I offer 2 clues, the first is the one he wrote about in his book Dreams of My Father and mentioned during his historic speech on race in Philly. He said, 'my grandmother loved me to death yet she was afraid and would look down, when black men passed on the street and that she made remarks which made him cringe' The second clue is that the parents of his HS prom date refused to let him escort her because she was white, and he had a white girlfriend at Columbia, but eventually saw it would not work, as she could not understand how race impacted him.
I often wondered how soul searing it had to be for him to know only white faces as the face of love, yet know how his grandmother was fearful of all that he was 'a black male' in our society. How does a developing mind reconcile that? That had to be one helluva cognitive dissonance with loud discordant chords strumming through his soul as he searched to determine what it meant for him.
I imagined he had to ask, how can I love a white woman who I know, based on my grandmother, will at the very core of her being be fearful of me? His intelligence would not let him choose a woman and have to doubt whether she truly could be committed to him given that his own grandmother harbored deep racial fears and surely he could not beleive that any person could love him more deeply than she.
His reason for calling himself black is also somewhat addressed in Dreams for My Father when he says, that he stopped telling people his mother was white, because he realized that he was actually seeking their acceptance on the basis of her race. It was a way for him to coerce them into looking beyond his race yet he realized if that was necessary they were unaccepting of him as he was not his mothers race. Thus he determined to cease telling his mothers race. Michelle talks about how she nor her mother knew for a long time that his mother was white, because Barack never talked about it.
I disagree with you about Michelle erasing anything premised on Toots and them not raising him right.
Rather, I think as Barack said during his run for the US Senate, if I am black when it comes to anything bad, like being stopped by the police or trying to hail a cab...why then should I be anything other than black when being recognized for the GOOD that I do and the achievements I have attained.
Barack says take my STRENGHTS and emblazon them black for no black male is the sum of the negative stereotypes that society presumes is true.
Yes, exactly! Whiterosebuddy - do you (or anyone else) remember when and where he made this remark? I'm assuming it was during an interview or in one of his books? If so, I'd love to see the full exchange...
February 19, 2007
Obama's 'Colorblind' Double Bind
By Clarence Page
"There are African-Americans who don't think that you're black enough, who don't think that you have had the required experience," reporter Steve Kroft asked Obama as they cruised Chicago's South Side during a recent "60 Minutes" profile.
"The truth of the matter is," Obama mused, gazing at the neighborhoods outside their vehicle's windows, "when I'm walking down the south side of Chicago and visiting my barbershop and playing basketball in some of these neighborhoods, those aren't questions I get asked."
No, those are the kind of questions some people ask about you when you're the first black presidential candidate to have a viable chance of winning.
"I also notice when I'm catching a cab," he quipped. "Nobody's confused about that, either.
Read complete article:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2007/...
They would have picked Ford, because he's high-yella with green eyes, but if he doesn't have that texturizer on his naps, the naps would give him away as a brotha.
Laughing my ass off. He will then drop her like a hot potato.
And he should know better than to put Olive Oil Sheen on with a heavy hand, when, like Brylcream, a little dab'll do ya. LOL
Re-phrase: "If Barack Obama is Barry Dunham, the local Metro bus-driver, he'd be "Barry the Bus-Driving Murderer."
Garvey laid it out and sixty years later, Chris Rock picked it UP.
They will claim him until he puts a foot wrong; then he gets slung under the bus with every other Black person.
And Marie Arana has issues - both with her own ethnic identity and everyone else's. She would do well to address her OWN issues before trying to tell people what constitutes being Black.
You know that, CPL.
I know that, CPL.
And, I know Barack knows it too.
THANK YOU!! :>)
Let me know when I may ARISE! :>) :>)
He'll be a NIGGER.
Being black is like holding the all the Aces in deck of cards.
"Sorry, you’re just going to have to deal with the full complexity of Black humanity"
Sure you right, rikyrah
The title alone said all i needed to hear.
If its entitled He's Not Black, all the rest is clearly folk talking amongst themselves.
Ms. Arana seems like a nice enough and educated enough woman, but she knows piddle about being Black in America, therefore i got no time for her.
this article was MUCH more interesting
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar...
They gave Vanessa back to the Black Community faster than a mangy dog could spread fleas.
LMAO.
Plus, she turned out to be a damned fine actress and singer (another candidate for who could have played Etta James in Cadillac Blues).
Didn't this author recently write another stupid article about race? Her name rings bells for me.
"When White folks claim bi-racial Pookey that just robbed the liquor store and shot 3 people, then I’ll know it’s not just about trying to divorce Obama from the Black community."
I take the line that it is up to the bi/multi-racial person to define themselves. Society may define them, because that's what race is, a societal construction. However, I believe the individual has the final word.
Obama says he's a Black man with a White mother and Black father, who was raised by his White grandparents, and who married a Black woman and has two Black daughters. So I see Obama as a Black man. End of story.
America is just gonna have to catch up to the complexity of Blackness. To quote rikyrah: "WTF do you think Black folk are?”
And you make a great point about telenovellas and Spanish TV in general. The rare, once-in-a-blue-moon time I see a Black Latin person, it's Mammie crying over Monsignor’s children. For real. So my Latin@ sistren and breddren, as much as I am a HUGE proponent of coalitions, I will allow you the space and time to get your own house in order before attempting to decorate mine. And I know this is a serious topic that is currently being held in the Latino communities...much like our own in the Black community as it relates to color-struckness. (Don't even get me started on color-struckness!!)
If Black folk are still running around talking about the 1/36th Cherokee princess they have in their bloodlines because of some picture they saw of great-great-great-Granny Mae where she was wearing plaits and they wanna claim that as Native American, then Obama can be a Proud Black Man.
Colorstruck = Black on Black racism
If white people can tout their 'preference' for whiteness above all else and we denounce that, then we need to get real about Black racism and the whole keen features/good/hair/skin tone crap.
This is why so many of us (particularly browner-skinned girls) have self-esteem issues and it's not coming from whites. White people are not measuring skin shade.
My Cherokee-Choctaw-Creole Maternal Grandmother didn't buy that her light skin, long, wavy hair and keen features were the epitome of beauty. She pissed off my great-grandparents when she ran off and married my grandfather, a direct descendant of African slaves, and not the Creole/half White guy her parents chose because she already identified with being a Colored woman in the 1920s. She purposely wanted her children to have that rich, mahogany color of my grandfather and said as much. My mother and her siblings were not allowed to favorably treat others who were light-skinned; that shyt earned them whippings from my grandmother, for whom I am named.
My paternal grandmother, also a blend of Choctaw-Blackfoot-Seminole-Creole, had serious color issues and got pissed when all her sons married medium-brown to dark brown skinned women. The only grandchildren she had any interest in were the ones my aunt and her half-white husband had. Never mind that the husband was a serial adulterer who fathered nine kids with three other women outside the marriage; when my aunt wanted to leave, my color-struck granny persuaded her to stay with my whoring uncle until the day came that my uncle tried to run over my aunt in the street in downtown Houston, with one of his mistresses in the car.
I don't know why my uncle thought he could go home after that scene, but he did, and caught a bullet from my aunt; she'd had enough. Imagine if my aunt had been properly taught the self-esteem she needed; she was a truly beautiful woman with waist-length hair and dark chocolate colored skin, but because she was taught light was right - she stayed in a marriage that outlived its shelf life the day my oldest cousin was born.
Sorry to rant, but these stories bring up these memories for me, and the shyt I've had to fight on my own level since I was a teen-ager and began dating guys who grew up with these warped foolishness of what constitutes being Black in America and warped standards of beauty among Black women.
When is the book coming out???? I would love to read more. My Cuban granny had enough with my cheating grandfather and cut his ear off with a Machete. Maybe I need to write a book too!
My father is a Jewish third generation biracial man (basically, my biracial grandparents kept the bloodlines half-and-half, lol), and my mother is 1/4 Indian (relating to India, not Native America), 3/4 African woman. But this is common to Blackness, that's what gets me the most about this whole discussion.
America, and people of other nationalities who buy into the European mindset of beauty, refuse to speak truth to power about the beauty of Blackness, and (let's just keep it real) how much they want us. We've got hundreds of thousands of millions of Black folk with almost every nation/tribe/tongue in their bloodlines, but everyone wants to act like they don't know how it got there.
Riiiiiight!
I walk with my head high, because my parents let me know that despite the multitude of cultures and races in my blood, I am and always will be a Black woman. It could just be the West Indian background (my mother is Trini and my father is Jamaican), we've always been very Black Pride/Black Power. (Marcus Garvey, Shirley Chisholm, Louis Farrakhan, etc.)
The world may put us on the bottom. But when I look outside and I see our many complexions, shades, and cultures, I know when the lights come off there's a whole other story being told!
The guys there are intellectuals and the way they say stuff with that British accent is a major turn-on; but be warned, they're not into good dental hygene (which was a major turn-off for me, LOL. I like guys with teeth)
My ex-boss has a mouth full of decayed teeth that are now starting to cause her health problems elsewhere. She might end up with dentures - but the reason she wouldn't go to the dentist and get fillings or root canals when it was feasible?
She would have to take pain meds after treatment and that would interfere with getting her drink on!!!!! She wants a man and wonders why the hell they run away when she opens her mouth and foul stench emerges....EWWWWWWWWw
<<<ducks>>>
I want to know what is the appealing mystery of white women for Black men. Not that it would change anything.
I just hated she stayed with my uncle, bore him 10 kids and he still strayed outside the marriage, which, by the way, was totally shotgun (cause she was not of legal age, even though she looked older than she was), until her beauty faded and she was too worn out to start over with a man who would have loved her for herself.
I was 17 when I met my first husband. He was 19. He was black, cherokee, white, all rolled up in there. I have mahoney brown skin. I had long wavy hair down the middle of my back. When he took me to meet his mother, she oohed and awed all over me. When she left the room I heard her tell her daughter. "Indeed, Lucy, she's got pretty hair, but she's soooooo dark!" I'm was like oh shit, what have I gotten myself into? It was the first time, I'd every had heard another black person talk like that to me.
When I asked my ex husband WTF? he said oh, don't pay her any mind, that woman is crazy. I love mother, but the woman is just silly crazy." I loved him more and took his word that he loved me just as I was.
My mother-in-law kept the remarks to herself when it came to me, but she'd still remark on other folk's skin tone, hair, and she'd make references to my daughters when they were born. My ex husband would tell her to shut up and mind her damn business. The marriage lasted 13 years.
So true. My white friends cannot see the skin shade difference that I can see. Maybe it's in their programming. But as Q-Tip once said, "Black is Black."
I'm always asking, am I white or Jewish? And the answer depends totally on context. It's been my experience that I feel most awkwardly Jewish when I'm around WASPs , particularly if they are dominant in a local population, because I feel so Other. Particularly because I grew up in a time of quotas and was very aware of where we were welcome and where we were not.
On a day to day basis, yeah, I'm white. Pasty even. But I notice.
What you call black racism is what is called internalized racism which is caused by years of indocrination and socialization of white supremacy-anything closer to white is desirable and better. Blacks as well as Asians, Hispanics and others have this same sorry problem so to say tat it does not come from whites or by extension whiteness is inaccurate.
By the way, whites do see color and have for centuries. They have 2 eyes and they work. I will never forget the day when a white couple complimented my mother on her "none ethnic features".
Its unfortunate.
When I meet up with blacks who have moderate to severe symptoms of the slave mentality, I can only shake my head and feel sorry for them.
-Very good point and I agree with it.
Someone on this thread mentioned Rev. Wright; another good point.
When the 'god damn America" sound bites came out, the hand wringing started:
"Oh, how could Obama just sit there and hear this black preacher say this?"
"Ohhhh, I'm going to faint!"
I didn't hear anyone say, "Well, he's not black, he's biracial."
President-Elect Barack Hussein Obama has defined himself as BLACK.
Deal with it.
I didn't hear anyone say, "Well, he's not black, he's biracial."
ORRRRR- that he heard the Rev's statements with ONLY ONE EAR
and ONE HALF of his BRAIN :>)
He WAS considered ALL BLACK by people making that statement.
WHEW!!! :>) **shakin' my head**
You are absolutely correct; Barack Obama was considered "ALL BLACK."
There were NONE of the semantics we are hearing now...now that he is "President-Elect".
I just had to bring that back to the FRONT!! We all know who it is that's really gonna have Obama's back when he makes an unpopular decision.
Which is all the more reason Obama shouldn't take the Black community for granted. Because we will have his back when everyone else leaves him. We know it's coming, we know it's coming.
We stood by Michael Jackson until that second allegation of child molestation. The only reason we did was that first kid got fat paid to drop the charges and we smelled something foul. But a second allegation ten years later? I wrote Michael off after the first one because I believed if he wasn't guilty, he shouldn't have paid the money and fought those parents in court. He caved and I got suspicious then and there.
We stood by OJ's dumb ass when he was acquitted of killing his white ex-wife, only to watch that fool trash his freedom because he thought he was above retrieving his Heisman Trophy and other artifacts in the proper way. Now his black ass is prison bound - he'd better not drop the soap.
We stood by Michael Jordan as the allegations of his heavy gambling and his cheating on Juanita became public knowledge that tarnished his "good guy" image. We watched him pay money to his mistresses not to rat his ass out - and one of them had a history of purposely getting preggers by pro-athletes so she'd have a damned mealticket for the next 20 years; but God help a sista if she gets pregger by a pro athlete because she has to take his ass to court, submit to DNA testing before the fool gives her a red nickel.
And what did supporting them going through their crisis get the Black Community as a WHOLE? Did they re-embrace US; start giving back to our Communities? HELL, NO; they ran from US...AGAIN. Earning the Black Community a large allegation that we're willing to give the bad actors in our race a free pass because they're African-American - which is an allegation I've never bought into.
I think we all hope Obama won't take the Black Community for granted; unlike these characters I've named, I have no doubt if this brotha takes us for granted, he does so at his own peril and we will let him feel the sting of erroneous thinking very early in the game.
Look at West Africans.
Now, look at the range of colors amongst the Black community here in America."
I know this isn't the focus of the post, but this statement really bothers me. West Africans are a range of colors as well, some of it due to "mixing" with Europeans. I'm sick of hearing Black Americans telling me that I don't look African...
Thank you for this post. I have been so bothered by this topic and I am glad that you started this conversation again. I am just scratching my head when I hear people especially those OVER 50 act as if most biracial people have not always self-identified as black. But, I guess you are right, they never thought that once they had a "choice" that most would chose to still be black or embrace their African heritage.
If they only knew how offensive it is for them to wonder why he calls himself black. Maybe some people like being black. I know that I love it!
Oh, and the British West Indies are not immune to this either. Don't even get me started...
</snark>
<snark>
I think that's a great way to f**k with folks heads.
Annnnnnd, IFF they happen to find something in my bag which they THINK that I shop-lifted, I'm only going ta give back HALF of it!! :>)
Enjoy the rest of it! :>) :>) :>)
They won't want that in the HEADLINES!! :>)
the only thing that struck me and leads me to my point was when you said that Barack doesn't even look Bi-racial.
That's what it boils down to: what we see. As far as I'm concerned, I am not mixed (i.e. I have two black parents from two black parents of their own. Now where it goes from there, I don't know). However, people have always insinuated that I was mixed or biracial, much to the chagrin of my mother, because I have hazel eyes and VERY curly hair.
Barack Obama could go the Tiger Woods route and say that he's not black, he is the culmination of the mixing of many races of his parents. BUT when the world looks at him, he has striking African features so they will associate him with that color - no matter how small the percentage of black he may be.
Instead, Obama has chosen to associate with the color that he is most readily identifiable as (and seems to have the least connection to insofar as his father is concerned). If he had decided to say clearly that he was not black and that he was white because he is half white and raised by his white mother, I HIGHLY doubt that the white community would welcome him with open arms.
I mean, like you mentioned before, I cannot take comments on race and race mixing too serious from someone not inside the fence.
Vicente Guerrero, a mulatto and Mexico’s 2nd president, was a hero in Mexico’s War of Independence from Spain. The state of Guerrero in Mexico was named in his honor. His grandson, Vicente Riva Palacio y Guerrero, was one of Mexico’s most influential politicians and novelists.
In addition, one of the most prestigious generals in Mexican’s War of Independence, José María Teclo Morelos y Pavón, was a mulatto as well.
Something between 200,000 and 500,000 African slaves were brought to Mexico...
You would have to look real hard to find any evidence of them today.
All my life [It's been long. :>)], I've been checking AFRICAN-AMERICAN/BLACK/NEGRO/COLORED. :>) [The boxes have undergone a metamorphosis. :>) :>)]
NOW that this issue has been raised, imma check a FEW boxes to indicate the I'm "soma this and soma that!!! :>) :>)
So what they gonna do with THAT information?? :>) :>)
My Grandfather and his siblings are the likely offspring of a white man and their Black mother. I write this to note that my personl infomration is aligned with Henry Louis Gates analysis of the semi-random famous sample in his public research. Race in America is very much cultural and genetic.
I asked you then, I think, to begin the conversation. Give us a starting point. I'm game, but I need to get a feel of where you're coming from in this conversation.
Yes! I have personally been relishing this fact for some time now.
I NEVER feel good being called black. I think people feels comfortable in being called that because they despise being called an african.
Damn i am an African, it is a race, NOT a political or social construction as black hispanic, white, yellow ARE.
When he was selected president of the Harvard Law Review, 1990:
''The fact that I've been elected shows a lot of progress,'' Mr. Obama said today in an interview. ''It's encouraging.
''But it's important that stories like mine aren't used to say that everything is O.K. for blacks. You have to remember that for every one of me, there are hundreds or thousands of black students with at least equal talent who don't get a chance,'' he said, alluding to poverty or growing up in a drug environment.
Whether one agrees with it or not, Obama "includes" himself with Blacks as well as his mother's parentage. "We", as in black people didn't box him in to anything....it seems he came to terms with what he related to a long time age.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/obama/130...
A few years ago, I visited the Pequot Museum at the Foxwoods Casino and Resort in Connecticut. Throughout the museum, they have life-size replicas of the historical Pequot Indians living as they did three, four, five, even ten centuries ago. They also have a film depicting how the Pequots were attacked and fought against white settlers. Both the replicas and the actors in the movie look much like the sterotypical American Indian.
However, this is where it gets interesing: the staff at the museum and the casino, almost all Pequots, and the large photos around the museum of the members of the Pequot tribe today, are very different. Almost every one of them looks like an African-American - granted, a light-skinned or medium-brown skinned African-American, but black nonetheless, with hair and features much more typical of blacks than Indians.
During a tour of the museum, the tour guide asked if any of us had any questions. I asked when and how did the Pequots intermarry with African-Americans? I assumed it might be like other stories I had heart of escaped slaves who took refuge with Indian tribes, but I thought it would be interesting to hear the actual story. The guy's response: "We've never intermarried with African-Americans."
Me: Um... yes, you have. You wouldn't look the way you do if you hadn't.
Tour guide (now angry and defensive): We're not mixed with black! We're 100% Indian!
So I agree, many non-blacks in this country owe a lot to blacks, both as (many times) part of their heritage, and as those at the forefront of the struggle for equality for *all* people.
'
OTOH, I wouldn't say we're the only TRUE Americans. Other groups have made significant contributions as well. Recently, HuffPo had an article about how Native Americans serve in the armed forces at a greater rate per capita than any other racial group in this country.
The Godfather of SOUL -Mr. James Brown
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VRSAVDlpDI
You'll get a kick out of this one!!! LOL!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKCsUWx-QoA
Clearly! I thought that I was the only one that was bothered by everyone referring to the President Elect of the United States, by his first name. I cannot recall the first or the last time I heard the current POTUS referred to as GEORGE!
You are not alone.
They ALL betta git ta PRACTICIN' - that would be - Mr. President; YOUR ROYAL HIGHNESS, MR. POTENTATE; YOUR GRACE; HIS IMMINENCE and "such as. . . " :>) :>)
As my mom would say when we called out to an ADULT - "You betta put a "HANDLE ON THAT NAME!" :>)
Annnnnnnnnd, they betta STAND UP!! :>) :>)
For anyone to argue with how someone else identifies themselves is truly special. On a purely practical level, in this country, it's not who you are, it's what you look like.
The color of a person's skin has been an integral part of these "United" States. That color played a part in whole economies; started wars; made laws that affected education, real estate purchases and business dealings.
African, Colored, Negro, Nigger, Nigra, Negress, Boy,
Why are people who don't identify as Black so quick to suggest that Black people forget our beautiful and tortuous history in this country? I don't want to dwell on the pain that my mother felt when she couldn't find a job because her college degree said "Negro" but neither do I want to forget it.
Ask a Jewish person to forget the holocaust. Ask a Japanese American to forget WWII internments? Ask a Native American to ignore being herded onto planta.. oops, reservations? I DON'T THINK SO.
But let President Elect Obama identify himself HIMSELF as a black man, and now it's a problem. Let him choose a black woman as his wife and the mother of his children, and people are flippin' out.
Whew Far, far from 'post-racial' in my book. In fact, I'm not even sure what that means. Race and culture are forever intertwined. Why would I want to 'get past' all that?
Which goes to the heart of what I have been saying for years. I have traveled extensively abroad, and when I am in another country---without exception---I am seen as American first, black second. However, in the land of my birth it is the opposite---has always been the case, and sadly may always be.
That is the reality in the USA plain and simple, and I'm sick of people trying to make it out like if I somehow get over it that the circumstances will magically change.
That writer wants attention. Looks like he's getting it.
Poor latinos getting a bad reputation from the irresponsible statements this woman has made!! Now we have as a racial "expert" this very privileged and powerful lady who --in the best American tradition of reinvention-- in middle age has conveniently embraced her father's Hispanic/Peruvian heritage now that being Latino had finally become chic and marketable. I'd take everything this self-styled arbiter and spokeswoman of all things Hispanic, multiethnic and now even multiracial!! says with a huge grain of salt.
http://www.thejobagroup.org/?p=53
Thanks!
Curtis
As for his White European heritage (50%) - this is an established fact . I am not black,
but I gather that this term is principally used by African Americans. Black Africans
refer to themselves by their nationality. Obama in fact said it best - " a mutt , like me."
Exactly,,,,,,, Nothing wrong with that - that in layman's terms is what he is.
You know, "mutts" in general are healthier, smarter, live longer etc than pure breds.
From a genetic standpoint, Barak Obama is "better" than a someone who is mostly
one thing. Remember his mother ? It was she and her parents who nurtured the
President elect. Barak Obama is the son of a white woman and a native Kenyan
(black, if you will). That Kenyan wasnt around - he dumped his wife and son.
Running around Chicago doesnt make Obama black, neither do other people's
perceptions of him. I certainly hope that when Michelle looks at her husband she doesnt see a black man. I hope she sees HER HUSBAND. When I look at
Barak Obama, I see the next President of the United States. I absolutely believe
that he does not have the prejudices rampant in this forum . Yes, mixed heritage
seems make a better product.
And by the way, people who refer themselves by nationality tend to do so because they are outside of their home nation. No wonder a South African might call themselves South African upon coming to America. But at home, they might go by Afrikan, or black, or colored, or Afrikaaner, or Zulu. It's all in the context.
No one here is attempting to say that Barack Obama has no European ancestry. Neither is Obama himself. When he calls himself black, he's just getting in where he feels he fits in. If he likes it, I love it. You have an intolerance problem because you are unable to allow him to self-identify. He and we are not the ones with the problem.
The same goes for people. Jews for example, particularly the Ashkenazi subgroup have a very high incidence of genetic diseases BECAUSE historically this group did not marry out of the group. Mutts ARE a better product, in part because they dilute the incidence of mutations. Better product - for me, that means fewer genetic mutations that decrease the quality of life. Maligning ? This is not maligning- it is simply a fact.
Morale of the story ? Unions that produce produce people like Barak Obama
are good in the genetic sense and even in the social sense.
I am not intolerant of Barak Obama, I celebrate his mixed heritage.
This forum ignores half of what he is .
That is not the same thing as simply saying that genetic variation is good. We talked about genetic issues like Tay-Sachs and sickle cell down the thread - it's already been acknowledged that sometimes doctors can use someone's racial background to infer a disorder associated with a lack of genetic diversity. But the problem isn't that more people aren't RACIALLY mixed, it's that they aren't genetically mixed - these aren't one and the same thing. You're drawing a quick and dirty shortcut to get there. And it's more like prejudicial, inside-out eugenics than anything else to me.
African and supposedly is "black." If so, then you have nothing in common with him.
I presume our President Elect loved his mother and grandparents because of who they were not what their race was. ''
And why let US laws define you? Hispanics dont and will not ever.
We define ourselves, thats why Mariano Rivera is Hispanic,
So, the redneck racist matter? Sad, sad- that you allow that
segment of our society (gulp) even ruffle a hair on your head.
Barak Obama has no brothers, only a sister.
Luckily for him, it doesnt matter to her what he looks like.
Whatever.
Ramble on.....
obama is bi-racial
how dare black racists erase his white kin who reared him solo!
see more on obama's race at:
OUTLOOK
http://aliciabanks.blogspot.com
And so you should take your own advice and let Barack Obama be black, since that's how he wants to refer to himself.
wow.
Yes he is.
The problem though, doesn't seem to be Barack's or anyone else's...it seems to be yours. Why does it concern you if Barack Obama identifies himself as "black"? How does it harm you?
O.K. two things:
1. You stated that you check the box: BLACK. Is that for the purpose of IDENTIFYING YOUR ETHNICITY? "I check the "black" box unless they ask for ethnicity. I'm confused! Did you think that you were being asked for the AMOUNT OF MELANIN that you possess??
2. You have a CHOICE: DON'T check any of the boxes. Just DECLINE TO STATE.
**shakin' my head** Whew!
Sicle Cell Anemia is prevalent in Africa, the Mediterranean, India and the Middle East not just "Black" People.
HEY! :>) TEACH!! :>)
I'm gonna try this ONE MO' 'GIN:
Document X:
Ethnic Code/Ethnicity:
__Black
___White
___Hispanic
___Asian
___Other
What would/do YOU check?
Have I told you lately that I love you???
WHEEEWWW Oxygen mask....:LOLOL
CLARITY/LOGIC - I'm a simple person. :>) :>)
Back- at-choo!! :>)
S-T-R-E-T-C-H-I-N-G the "Oxygen Mask" to you!! :>)
Also, sorry you get grouped with Black folks just because of your complexion. That must suck for you. Try checking the Hispanic box next time.
It's been my experience that some West Indians don't like to check "black" because in this country, it's shorthand for "Black American," and that's not who they are - they have a different culture altogether. I'm not saying that this is your issue, but I will say that even countries in S.A. and the West Indies have their own local racial classifications. This is just how ours works here. The classifications are not going anywhere, though they may morph over time, like the names of neighborhoods, based on changing perspectives. But humans have been classifying since Adam named the animals. It's just names. Like you said, a societal construct. How is it any worse for people to identify with them than it is for you to reject them altogether? Ultimately, the labels only matter so much.
When Obama says he's Black, he is not rejecting his mother and grandparents, he is telling people how he culturally identifies.
When Black people claim other people of African descent, it is akin to welcoming or embracing kindred, and I don't understand where your puzzlement over that comes from, as we've been doing it since crossing the Atlantic.
Obama has made it clear on numerous occasions that he chooses to self-identify as black, so it seems to me that he is proving your point.
Those laws were enforced until the mid-late 60's - well within the lifespan of a large segment of the black population in this country.
In Virginia, the State Congress passed "The Racial Purity Act" seeking to identify and classify every individual in the state as to their racial background in the 1930's and 40's.
Race very much matters.
Look at the voting statistics for Obama in different locations across the US. Obama pulled 95% of the black vote - 5-7% above the "norm" - so race did matter to some percentage of black voters.
Obama pulled 45% of the white vote in industrialized "liberal"states, but only 15% in the states won by McTush - 20% BELOW the "norm. So race damn sure mattered to some white voters.
While I'm with you in the spirit that it shouldn't matter...
The painful reality in a country with the long bitter history of ours is...
It does.
Again, you claim that people should be called whatever they want to be called instead of accepting the labels society throws on them.
Barack Obama WANTS to be called "black." YOU and others like you want to FORCE the man to call himself "biracial."
So am I to understand that people can call themselves whatever they want to call themselves, as long as it's not black? For you to have this mindset you are
a) a self hating black person who wishes they were anything but black;
b) a biracial person who needs Obama to claim "biracial" to validate your own shoddy sense of self worth.
c) a non-black person who does not like black people and can only justify liking Barack Obama if he can be something other than black i.e. "just a man" or "biracial."
Yet if a video came out on Fox News today showing Barack Obama taking off his belt and whipping Sasha and Malia for running around the White House and then later throwing his feet up on the Oval Office desk and knocking back a 40, you'd be the first one decrying how "black" he is.
Fiona,check -a-c and call it a day, honey.
LOL @ feet up on the Oval Office desk knocking back a 40...
ouch!
LOL
half American ( white European ancestry). Culturally, he was raised in a white family -
so he was not brought up with Kenyan culture or language. In Hawaii, he was surrounded by the mutltiethnic culture that is Hawaii. He also spent some time as a child in Indonesia. No, Barak Obama is definitely not black. Robert De Niro isnt black just because he has a black wife and children who have skin like their mother. Ditto, Barak
Obama - MIchelle Obama and their children , dont make Barak Obama black.
He is the product of his upbringing - almost none of which is African American.
He is a MAN, lets leave it at that.
So Professor Juana. (I figured you as a geneticist.) What constitutes being Black since Barack is too God awful retarded not know that he is not Black.
BTW, Am I West Indian because I grew up in a Caribbean neighborhood?
Go figure.
Soooo... American means white European ancestry? No. That's where you lost me, Barack Obama what he identifies himself to be.
Co-sign! He can BE whateva he wants! :>)
BWA HA HA HA HA HA
why do you come and drop the truth like that?