Jack and Jill Politics - Latest Comments in Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Anonymous — Mon, 28 Apr 2008 03:16:00 -0000

If the SuperDelegates give this to Hillary, I swear I will make it my goal to unseat ever negro "politician" that voted for her. Top of the list of Tubbs-Jones, on top of everything, she is just a bad person. While I will feel bad about Jackson-Lee, there must be repurcussions.

And Maya Angelou? I know she is not elected, but remember when she said we should support Clarence Thomas because he was Black, despite what he did to fellow woman Anita Hill? We knew better, she didn't. It seems to me that folks with bad judgement keep making the same mistakes. Barack is right.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

B-Serious — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 08:22:00 -0000

Why is Hillary special. No one threw a fit when people asked John Edwards. Same with Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, Fred Thompson. . .

I meant to say:

"No one threw a fit when people asked John Edwards to drop out back in January."

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

B-Serious — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 08:18:00 -0000

http://reachblack.blogspot....

ariane said, "You know Sen. Clinton has an extremely loyal following especially the women who want so badly to see a woman president. They have been incensed at calls for her to drop out and if the superdelegates were to all endorse now and Obama clinches it, they would be very upset at an attempt to force her out before all the votes were counted."

That's what I don't get. Would those super delegate have been willing to extend the SAME curtesy to Obama supporters if the shoe was on the other foot?

Would Obama be allowed to keep changing the goal posts if his campaign was in debt; he lost 11 straight contests by an AVERAGE of 33%; his negatives were above 50%; nearly 60% of the party thought he was dishonest; AND he was using all of his time to bloody the frontrunner and kill the party's chances in November?

When does someone tell Hillary and her supporters to get over it? 'Cause that's EXACTLY what they'd tell Obama supporters in that situation.

Why is Hillary special. No one threw a fit when people asked John Edwards. Same with Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, Fred Thompson. . .

Those people didn't have to drop out when they did. This is nothing personal against Hillary. She's being asked to drop out because THE MATH DOES NOT WORK FOR HER.

Like others before her, she's reached the point where her personal ambition conflicts with the goals of the party (and quite possibly the country). It's that point where most candidates do the honorable thing and step aside for the good of the party. But I guess it's asking waaaay to much of Hillary to give up her entitlement.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ariane — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 21:57:00 -0000

From what I have heard from a superdelegate who has been in touch with others they are waiting for the remaining contests because they do not want to have the appearance that they forced it to end. Personally I am torn about that - -I hate what is going on with the Clintons, the Republicans and the MSM infotainment/Faux + Faux-wanna-bes ganging up on Sen. Obama and allowing Clinton to change the goalposts to a version of "popular vote" that counts states in which there was no campaign, but does NOT count caucus states.

But it may backfire if they were to end it now. You know Sen. Clinton has an extremely loyal following especially the women who want so badly to see a woman president. They have been incensed at calls for her to drop out and if the superdelegates were to all endorse now and Obama clinches it, they would be very upset at an attempt to force her out before all the votes were counted.

I'm not saying there's nothing else going on! I'm sure some of them are really not certain when it comes down to it that they want a nominee who's half black, and they're looking for any excuse not to give it to him. Or they're scared of what revenge the Clintons may take on them, and they've never been able to get the idea of her inevitability out of their heads.

I do think it is amazing that the question is NOT widely being asked, how can Clinton possibly win without the black vote? This is the culmination of being taken for granted for years by the Party - -they actually believe that even if she steals the nomination after portraying Obama as a scary black guy, the black voters will come home to her in Nov. Ha! I don't see her getting half of the black vote, maybe not 30%. Not that most will vote for McCain - - they just won't vote. (Though I hope people would at least come out to vote for any good candidates farther down the ballot)

I hope it doesnt come to that. I hope we will have our nominee who earned it - -BUT this is not going to be easy, we can't just sit back and hope. Keep busy--donate, get busy and MAKE CALLS to NC and IN - - go to the website and sign up, and you can make calls from home, it is scary at first but you can do it and it can be VERY effective. Or go to one of the next states to work for the campaign if you can manage it.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Anonymous — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 10:42:00 -0000

Sigh. Leaders within the Democratic party like Clyburn and Brazille are neither weak nor suspect. Their neutrality was the price paid for proper black representation in the presidential election process.

In order to get SC pushed up to top billing---and therefore black representation---as one of the January sanctioned primaries, these so-called weak leaders had to give their words that they would not endorse during the primaries or influence the black vote. So, in essence these "weak" leaders had to give up their voice so that black voters could have more of a voice.

Traditionally Iowa and New Hampshire were always first but some of you may be old enough to know that blacks and hispanics (represented by Nevada in top four billing this year) traditionally voted later in the primary season with little impact, even though blacks have been the party's most loyal constituency. Most states get drowned out in Feb, specifically SuperTuesday, by California and New York and after that it is usually pretty much over.

With Dean at the helm, a deal was struck to give more prominence to the most loyal base by moving SC up but people like Clyburn and Brazille had to agree to NOT endorse so that seemingly ungrateful people good get their long deserved position of power in the primaries. Mr. "weak" Clyburn helped give you the frontrunner with his suspect silence because SC saved Obama and was the driving force for him being crowned the new of Camelot.

I'm surprised to stop by and see attacks on Clyburn and Brazille. Showing chinks in the armour so quickly and so easily will not serve the candidate well but that has always been used against the community. I guess that is the way it works, always divided and easily defeated. Rest assured Clyburn and Brazille will endorse when the nominee is solidified but IMO their silence more than paid off in the political windfall that was SC and the Kennedys and I for one appreciate it.

It was interesting observing here for a minute but it is time for me to move on. Best wishes for continued discussions and success to all members here. Keep up the good fight.

I have a plane to catch.

Goodbye and good luck!

---OOO

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Val — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 08:21:00 -0000

You know, after I heard the media spin after Tuesday I was so disgusted I pledged not to watch tv. But that is not an option because this is just too important. I feel the best way to counteract this crap is to donate to Barack's campaign. Money talks and bullshit walks.

I don't know the best way to encourage supporters to support Barack but I feel that if we were to donate to him before the end of April, only an idiot will hold to the perception that Barack can't win in November. Face it a 5 year old can beat McCain so the electable argument is a complete farce.

How can we encourage folks to donate to Barack. If we can help him raise another 10M before the end of month that is a decisive slap in the collective faces of the Clintons and the biased media.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Anonymous — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 01:01:00 -0000

Know hope...know hope.

And let's raise our voices in a chorus that demands that Obama be the Democratic nominee, and that Hillary Clinton drop out.

Lacking that, let's raise our voices demanding the Democratic party put an end to this bloodletting and slime campaign by the Clintons and decide on Obama as the nominee.

One thing you have to hand it to the GOP: they would have shut this thing down a long time ago, esp. if they had a candidate as appealing as Obama. They would not have allowed a fraction of the crap that Hillary has brought into this contest.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 00:53:00 -0000

ok ok I really am going to bed but I have to say this before I forget...I keep seeing these videos of Sen. Bayh sittng or standing behind Hillary with a half silly look on his face and I kept thinking it reminded me of something I had seen before. It finally came to me...and I am ageing myself.

He reminds of Alfalfa (he just needs a cowlick) and Hillary is Darla....i.e the Little Rascals.

Sorry all...but, now every time I see Sen. Bayh I think of Alfalfa.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:51:00 -0000

I did not see Pelosi, but, I unfortunately watched Chris Matthews "gush" all over Hillary tonight...saying she has run "a great campaign" huh??? I guess he was giving her kudos for having lied all over the map and still out there trying to destroy Obama. I don't know...I'm beginning to think this guy is bipolar.

Whatever...it was enough to make a person gag. I still wonder why the media doesn't give Obama credit for still standing on his own two feet and in the lead to one of the most formidable political machines ever? No, they would rather dwell on lapel pins.

Even though I graduated from college and am 58 years old and have experienced alot in life...my view points are meaningless.

No, we have to put up with George simpleminded S and the Chris Matthews of the world and what they choose to spew out for the sound bites of the week.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

TruthSeeker — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:24:00 -0000

Did you guys watch CNN? Pelosi did an interview with Larry King and when asked about the joint ticket she said 'no' almost before the question fully left Larry's lips. She said it is the candidates choice of who they have the comfort level to govern with and the choice shouldn't be thrust on them...paraphrasing.

There was also a panel talking about Rev. Wright. Poor Roland was jumping around trying to stamp out that fire again. The Republican on the panel was positively orgasmic to be able to bring up all the inflamatory statements once again. Wright has a speech coming up - I forget where - Roland thought that it might be cancelled.

It is unfortunate, I think Wright might be a very nice man in circumstances where his authority isn't threatened. Maybe he is kind of smearing Obama with the label "politician" and all the profanity that that holds....while blessing himself with the label "pastor" and all the supposed righteousness that holds. Isn't he supposed to be retired????

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:59:00 -0000

Dear Ms Martin;

I know it is hard to take...I still question people like Donna Brazile, Al Gore, John Edwards....so called party leaders...they know the outcome....just say it.

In my opinion they don't have the strength or courage to say what Obama does every day!!!!!!!!

This is one of the things I admire about Obama...he talks to us like adults and doesn't couch things like Clinton does. She is trying sell a story that just because she was married to Bill Clinton in the 90's - voting for her will restore all that. It is all a fallacy and voters should know that.

When will the democratic super delegates grow a spine and vote for the nominee who has shown his spine by beating one of the biggest most entrenched political machines ever!!!

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ms.Martin — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:58:00 -0000

Let me add to my last post:

If he feels that way then it's okay for him to say it.

He should not try and speak for the black community especially when he has remained uncommitted and shown no real leadership.

I want to know who these black people are he's talking too>

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Craig Hickman — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:58:00 -0000

Another MSM lie exploited by Hillary Rodham Nixon! Obama wasn't taking a day off. He was addressing UFCW in Chicago today.

Obama speaks to UFCW

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Craig Hickman — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:51:00 -0000

Maybe he wants more non-Black superdelegates to endorse first.

I don't know.

It just seems nutty.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ms.Martin — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:43:00 -0000

Well Angela

I don't know either, but what I do know is that I'm sick of these black so called leaders speaking for me when they can simply speak for themselves.

He's a black man, and a powerful one at that, he should speak for himself and do it loudly with a resounding endorsement for Obama. Until then, he can kiss my ass.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:38:00 -0000

I'm not black, but, my impression is that Clyburn is giving his endorsement to Obama without outright saying it.

I don't know all the answers...is Clyburn to chicken to come right out and say he endorses Obama. Is he trying to play the middle? I don't know. I'm just an observer trying to figure out like the rest of you...why the super delegates don't have the balls to endores Sen. Obama.

I'm not an insider...I don't know what threats the sd's have hanging over their heads...I don't know how many have a conscience....looks like not many at this point.

I just don't know...all I know is that I am one Democratic voter who will not vote at all if Hillary is annointed. Frankly, I hope the Democratic party will shrivel into a non-entity if they annoint Hillary.

I will cheer from the sidelines.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ms.Martin — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:35:00 -0000

Craig Hickman

You are reading my mind. They would like all the angry black people to start

"whining" about their candidate again.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Craig Hickman — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:33:00 -0000

Yes, ms.martin. Absolutely.

Don't forget, North Carolina is the home of Jesse Helms.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ms.Martin — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:31:00 -0000

Angela:

I sent an email to the DNC just before I saw your post.

I didn't talk to them about race though. I talked to them about Hillary's Republican tactics and the fact that she is working in unison with the Republican party.

Are they trying to get the race thing kicked off again before IN?

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Craig Hickman — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:31:00 -0000

If Clyburn was committed to keeping his mouth shut till this was all over, then why isn't he keeping his mouth shut till this is all over?

I don't like it.

Allows the Clintons to be victims.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Ms.Martin — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:27:00 -0000

Thanks Angela:

What I would like to know is why hasn't Clyburn come out for Obama if he feels so strongly about this. IT IS TIME FOR THE SUPER DELEGATES TO MOVE!

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:26:00 -0000

I say we step letter to the supers who haven't endorsed Sen. Obama.

I also say we step up our letters to the DNC to let them know we have recieved Mr. Clyburns message loud and clear.

And I'm not black...get all your friends onto this....this is not just a black community, this is an OBAMA community.

Put up or shut up...that is my motto.

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Craig Hickman — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:26:00 -0000

One tremendous IF YOU to the process

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Angela — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:17:00 -0000

whoa...just reported in the NYT

"In an interview with The Times late Thursday, Mr. Clyburn said that Mr. Clinton’s conduct in this campaign has caused what might be an irreparable breach between Mr. Clinton and an African-American constituency that once revered him. “When he was going through his impeachment problems, it was the black community that bellied up to the bar,” Mr. Clyburn said. “I think black folks feel strongly that that this is a strange way for President Clinton to show his appreciation.”

Mr. Clyburn added that there appears to be an almost “unanimous” view among African-Americans that Mr. and Mrs. Clinton “are committed to doing everything they possibly can to damage Obama to a point that he could never win.”

Re: Flipping the Script: WHY Can’t Hillary ‘ Tonya Harding’ Clinton CLOSE THE DEAL?

Anonymous — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 22:09:00 -0000

At this point we expect the Clintons to be in the gutter.

But we also need to face the fact that the media is in so many ways a shameless bunch as well, and they just buy into the Clinton narrative.

If we had a responsible media, they would be pounding the drum hard every day reminding everyone that Hillary cannot win and at this point is just destructive to the party.

Instead, they repeat all her talking points. It really is sickening. And the cable outlets keep hiring the Bush liars from the far right: Rove, Snow, etc. It seems they are stocking up on conservative liars and demagogues, all trying hard to be Fox News.

And Hillary is to blame for this. If she had run a decent campaign, the far right tactics would have so much less legitimacy. And if she had done the right thing and dropped out after losing 12 in a row, then when the right wing would have attacked Obama, he would have had the full shield of the Democratic party to protect him.

Hillary is literally trying to make the whole country racist in her quest to win, and make the whole country lower themselves to the Rush Limbaugh level. She is doing more than harming the party; she is harming the country.

I think all of us ordinary people need to beat the drum and stomp our feet and get mad as hell and demand that Hillary be forced to drop out.

We need to remind the Democratic party that they cannot win without the black community, or the party activists, or the young people, etc. And we won't stand the Hillary smear campaign to go on any longer.

We also need to make it clear to the Democratic party leaders that we will blame any general election defeat on Hillary Clinton and that she would not have a chance in hell of winning the presidency at a future date.