Jack and Jill Politics - Latest Comments in Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

aaronraul — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 22:31:34 -0000

If blacks dont get beyond their racism and anger at white people they will continue to be played.Im BLACK that being a state of mind that realizes ther is A MALE DOMINATED EUROCAUCASIAN POWER STRUCTURE THAT HAS MEMBERS OF ALL RACES TO DO THEIR BIDDING.ITS PURPOSE IS TO ENSLAVE THE MINDS OF ALL RACES THROUGH DIVISIONS OF GENDER RACE RELIGION AND CLASS.THIS IS THE POWER STRUCTURE BEHIND OBAMA LOOK AT THE CHASM BETWEEN HIS RHETORIC (A UNITER)and the results of his camapaign (divisions)YOU CAN DELUDE YOURSELF into believing that we are uncle toms haters afraid of progress and all of this other nonsense but we are soldiers and students of history of political propaganda and thought control.On my previous post I mentioned several theories to stimulate thought.Clinton is a true progressive.As a student in college she worke with the ACLU to make sure the BLACK PANTHERS got a fair trial.Notice the things that media matters are Obama wont refute in Corsi book.crosscheck with other sources many true radicals with no agenda.Stop getting all your information from people who think like you and the media.Iunderstand a lot of you are young and new to this game but in order to be on top of the game you have to think of every scenario possible and then weigh them against what you see.DONT FORM YOUR PERCEPTION THAT BECAUSE OBAMA IS BLACK HES IN OUR CORNER,SO WAS PAPPA DOC MUGABE IDI AMIN. THE ONLY CRITICAL THINKING IVE SEEN ON THIS SITE IS MONICA AND LILYTIGER I KNOW THERES MORE OF US OUT THER AND WE ARE GOING TO BE NEEDE TO MAKE SENSE OF THIS AS THE GAME PROGRESSES

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Miranda — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 19:30:34 -0000

Your parents really did a bad job.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

dave crockett — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:44:09 -0000

monika,

Several years ago, when the Dems got spanked in the Congressional races, Don Fowler came to my campus (U of S. Carolina). Fowler, as you may know, is one of the architects of the Clinton/DLC "capture the center" strategy. He's also from right here in Columbia. These are his words below, practically a direct quote:

* Roughly a third of the electorate will vote Democrat, no matter what. Another third will vote Republican. The number may fluctuate a bit from year to year, but I believe this is the way it is. The winner is the party that's more successful in capturing that third of the electorate in the center.*

I almost wept. I thought, "Damn. This is why these people keep losing to vastly inferior candidates." All both these parties really do is sell a "brand," one of the first rules of branding is that you craft your appeal to your heaviest users, your "red meat" base in political parlance. You don't appeal to the casual users, the undecideds. They aren't influencers. They get influenced by others. Nike basketball doesn't craft its appeal to people who don't play basketball (even though they sell most of their shoes to people that don't play). The Republicans don't play to the center. They play to their base, who pulls the center to the right.

Unfortunately, I see Obama taking the Don Fowler assumptions and running that playbook play by play. It's one thing no to go out of your way to antagonize white folks. That's wise. But that's not the same as letting them run you over. Even *they* don't respect that who just kisses their butts. It feels like Obama has denounced damn near every black person he's not married to. I saw an Obama ad here in SC a couple days ago focused on the economy and the mortgage crisis. It had NO black people. Not one. Come on brother! You can do better than that. And WE have to demand that from him--but without engaging in insane fratricidal attacks. I definitely agree with the tenor original post.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Plantsmantx — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:14:19 -0000

You know Jibreel, the novelty of militant Tomism is starting to wear off:)

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

monika — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:34:54 -0000

DC,
You won't hear this a lot on j and j but thank you. Sometimes I feel like I'm in twilight zone. My god, even MLK had black critics (like Malcolm X). DeBois criticized (hated) Booker T and Garvey but we still honor the memory of all these men.

Why are the motives of any black person who is not fervent supporter of Obama questioned. No one here can answer that, just like no one can explain that father's day speech.

Black men had been Obama's most ardent supporters up until that time.
Were a significant number of them MIA dads? Who knows? I do know if I had been a black man, I would taken as a gut punch.

This is how he repaid his earliest supporters.

That's not change I want to believe in

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

dave crockett — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 13:58:02 -0000

1. The one I was most personally insulted by was his Father's Day stunt, where he presumed to lecture black men everywhere on the importance of fatherhood. There was little nuance, and no real insight. It was scarcely better if at all than anything you could hear on right wing talk radio any day of the week. When I heard it, I didn't feel that he was even talking to black men at all. He was talking to white people, showing them he's not afraid to "tell it like it is" to blacks. He took the one day he might have held up those black men, no matter how few in number they may be, who handle their business. But he didn't. I felt sold out. You may disagree, but I don't think that's an unreasonable interpretation of his actions.

2. His capitulation on the death penalty, that it should be broadened. That is, to the best of my knowledge a change in position. My impression is not that this change of mind is based on some new data or new insight. He's chasing a segment of the voting public that frankly, probably isn't going to vote for him anyway. At the same time, to my knowledge, there has been no major statement about racial inequality in criminal justice. When you're the Senator from Illinois, and the question of the death penalty is raised, no matter how it's phrased, how can you NOT mention what has gone on in that state with its death row inmates?

With those two examples, the thing is I understand the political calculus of playing to the so-called center. I just think these Republican-lite tactics are losing tactics, and have been for a long time.

3. This final example isn't so much about DLC-inspired, as a question of basic political competence. Why does he continue to allow Hillary Clinton to just punk him unmercifully at every opportunity? I'm genuinely confused by this. The Clinton family is going to have more airtime than the Obama family at the convention. He's paying down her debt. After all that, I don't think it's an exaggeration to say, she hasn't exactly campaigned hard on his behalf. She's been civil. That's about it. He has not demanded that SHE "denounce and reject" anyone the way she demanded that he "denounce and reject" Farrakhan.

If this were my brother, cousin, or friend trying to reconcile with a former enemy I'd tell him, you're not being a bridge builder. You just think you are. You don't look magnanimous. You look like a punk.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

dave crockett — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 13:23:53 -0000

He is a one-time member, but then dropped his name from their roles. Nevertheless, Kerry wasn't a member of the DLC either but he ran their signature "capture the center" campaign.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Anderkoo — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 12:55:56 -0000

One of my colleagues has approached the campaign about conducting some hard-core network analysis of these sites, trying to determine if they're really astroturf sites thrown up by conservative/Republican/anti-Obama activists to look like grassroots blogs, etc. While I think there is genuine anti-Obama feelings among Hillary supporters, I also think a lot of it is being stirred up by fake Hillary supporters who are being seeded to keep stoking the resentment. (The exact same thing would have happened, in reverse, if Hillary were the nominee -- admit it; if Hillary got the nod, I'd be very disinclined to help her win).

Some of this circular firing-squad stuff is for reals, but I think we should start taking everything with a grain of salt and start looking into ways to expose the frauds among them.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Jibreel Riley — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 11:00:47 -0000

"he knows how to talk to people"

so dose pimps

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Jibreel Riley — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:57:34 -0000

The Truth Hurts... Thank you Jerome Corsi

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Lilytiger — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 02:49:07 -0000

Don't be fooled that it is only the pumas but the progressives are even more in their heads. This is the reaction to linking this blog to a site that I won't bother linking to. They don't deserve any traffic.
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That is the same view of the election, not a different one. Why must we all see it that way, or else be accused of all of these absurd things? I don't understand that.

Seriously, I don't understand this. What is it you would have people not think and not say?
What is it that is so threatening?

It seems to me that it takes a lot of work and mental gymnastics - listening to Limbaugh to drive oneself onto some sport of frenzy of fear, for example, or portraying any and all critical voices as Stalinists or something - in order to keep re-creating this all-or-nothing good versus evil scenario in your mind. And for what? Just to shut out unpleasant or disquieting thoughts?

"You are a bunch of commies and they are no different than fascists" and "you just tear down and don't have a plan" are not rational arguments, they are desperate attempts to discredit people who don't agree with you.

Support Obama. Vote for Obama. Whatever. Many will. Most here will, no doubt. What is the problem? If no critical analysis is to be tolerated, does that itself not suggest that there is something seriously wrong? Can we not talk about that?
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I have a bad feeling about this country and a bad feeling about many of the "enlightened" people and their thought processes. I am thoroughly depressed by this. I can't wait until we overtake the majority in this country, I'll be old but revenge is best served cold.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Monika — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 02:13:29 -0000

I think it's better to vote for McKinney or stay at home.

I think of how I wasted my vote on Kerry and Gore, I get mad at myself. They were the "best" candidates. Two men would would keep a Republican out of the White House. I voted for both men because I thought they had the experience and intelligence to lead this country. They had those qualities in spades, what they didn't have was balls. They wouldn't get down dirty and fight for the voters who believed in them.

Now I know not to waste by vote on someone who has the best chance of winning. Do we have the same values. Will he stand down when the Republicans kick him in the balls (and they will. This Fisher Price stuff is going to end after the convention).

You can say a lot of thing about McKinney, but no one will ever say she doesn't call it like she sees. No one will can question her commitment to progressive issues.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

aaronraul — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 01:03:30 -0000

Well Michelle youre going to see a lot more before this is over.The people that put these charades together called Presidential Elections are experts in marketing,psycology,advertising etc.Go through your house or apartment and pick out all the things that youve bought and hardly used ,all because they promised to make you feel good.Well thats what Obamas campaign is all about an illusion of power,If you want some real solutions check out my ideas on the Jesse Jackson Sr. says something appropriate thread about consumer power,boycotting,targetting companies through the internet to get them to invest in the community,why Im not afro american but I chose to be black.I went to private school and alot of my black friends were creole or upper echelon ,Icalled them BOURGEOISE.Yea just like this thread A BLACK BOURGEOISIE PERSPECTIVE, they thought thay were more classy or smarter than lower income blacks.But the way I see it theyre getting played just like everybody else but thyre also getting payed so that makes it a little more real.This election in going to cause more division than ever for thats the white power structures game,Divide and conquer you think Rove and them fell asleep at the wheel who do you think is behind Obama.Thweres no two parties thers just one with two faces thats why all candidates are two faced Power in this world is based on power against not power with.Thats why people are lead to conflict over religion race gender and class.Anyway enough is enough it seems most people dont even read each others comments.Its like when youre talking to somebody and ther not even listening because theyre thinking about what they want to say

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

GreenLadyHere13 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:47:04 -0000

B-Serious: WOW!! This post is amazing!!! I have learned sooooo much!

Thank you!!! :>) :>)

Whew! Educational Deep Breaths!!! :>) :>)

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Michelle — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:25:57 -0000

You might realize that demagogues on both the right and left do not like nuance. For while they’ll go on and on about their particular theories of “truth” to power, too many lack answers or ideas to test said truth in practice.

Yes. This.

Thank you.

There's something about this pattern that I never really saw clearly until this election season.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

rikyrah — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 23:03:18 -0000

Freudian slip my ass.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Angela1 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:59:16 -0000

This is interesting the same guy who wrote Obama Nation the anti Obama book (Jerome Corsi) apparently wasn't always a fan of McCain either.

found over at www.rightwingwatch.org

August 19, 2008
Jerome Corsi, McCain Basher

Current New York Times best-selling author and proven liar Jerome Corsi has been lavished with attention by the likes of Fox News and Rush Limbaugh for his slanderous new book about Barack Obama.

But before Corsi put Obama in his crosshairs, he plied his wares in the GOP presidential primary. Fox and Limbaugh treat Corsi like he’s a legitimate political commentator, so we’ll trust they’ll have Corsi back on to discuss his groundbreaking work on McCain:

Group tied to al-Qaida backs McCain for prez
March 02, 2008
By Jerome R. Corsi

McCain fortune traced to organized crime
February 26, 2008
By Jerome R. Corsi

Influence peddling claims dog McCain
February 15, 2008
By Jerome R. Corsi

John McCain funded by Soros since 2001
February 12, 2008
By Jerome R. Corsi

McCain aide touts 'Mexico first' policy
January 25, 2008
By Jerome R. Corsi

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

caligirl — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:49:26 -0000

the freaks come out at night.... the freaks come out at NIIIIIIGHT!

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

ra60785 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:49:25 -0000

Here's something I found that was written in March. Of course, the mainstream media is not picking up on it:

http://www.military.com/opi...

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

aaronraul — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:33:38 -0000

Heres some truth to power a lot of people seem to be ignoring .The white power structure runs this country and dominates most of the world.No one gets to be a candidate unless he is controlled by THE WHITE EURO/ZIONIST POWER STRUCTURE.Why do you think every candidate has to go to Israel and kiss the ring.So why does THE WHITE POWER STRUCTURE POSSIBLY WANT OBAMA ELECTED.They have rigged diabold voting machines that keep no record of who you voted for.All they have to do is make a candidate popular enough to lend credibility to their election. Bill Clinton holds thee key. He purposelly sabotaged his wifes campaign to give Obama the noomination. This is not conspiracy talk this is thinking like a strategist and not ascribing MTV emotions to one of the most powerful men in the world whos past is just as mysterious as Obamas(hes a Rockefeller.ame story missing father etc.) Obama has royal blood,even Lynn cheney had to admit the surface facts.Once you join the game you can only influence it. In this game the Clintons are the best friends Obama has.All presidents are blackmailable and expendable.In every political fabrication theres a kernal a truth This is the kind of critical worldview thats necesary to be prepared for whatever happens.Stay on top of the game dont let the game control you.Ask yourself why do all these afro american blogs beat the same Roland Martin story line. WE need people thinking outside the box if we as BLACK PEOPLE are going to aquire the type of real economic power necessary to overcome the conditions were in.Somehow people believe that Obama has circumvented all of the invested global power and launched himself into the democratic candidate , Or they think if he gets ther he can buck the system with no repercussions,Look behind all of these Kennedy comparisons.Kennedy and his brother signed off on wiretapping Martin Luther King and didnt get behind him until they had to,But dont forget they were blackmailable to.Through were.Chicago One of the most mob connected political machines in the country. The chicago mob helped put Kennedy in,they took over hollywood with the help of Ronald Reagen,and now there behind Obama,but why .Look at the timing of the Retzo indictment and Obamas announcement to run There all just PICES ON THE BOARD.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

arieswym — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 22:12:42 -0000

This makes me think of a Machiavelli quote that I read in the NY Times a while back that reflects on the the fear of change that crops up all the time in the campaign.

"It must be considered that there is nothing more difficult to carry out, nor more doubtful of success, nor more dangerous to handle, than to initiate a new order of things. For the reformer has enemies in all those who profit by the old order, and only lukewarm defenders in all those who would profit by the new order, this lukewarmness arriving partly from fear of their adversaries, who have the laws in their favor; and partly from the incredulity of mankind, who do not truly believe in anything new until they have had an actual experience of it. Thus it arises that on every opportunity for attacking the reformer, the opponents do so with the zeal of partisans, the others only defend him halfheartedly, so that between them he runs great danger."

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

B-Serious — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 21:16:04 -0000

Wait . . . I'm getting my haters mixed up. On second thought, I think the group might have been "No Deal," not PUMA.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Miranda — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 21:13:55 -0000

PUMA should be lining up tin cups to help with Hillary's debt problem:
http://politicalticker.blog...

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

B-Serious — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 21:13:12 -0000

co-sign. Thanks.

We need to stay focused.

Re: Remember . . . This is What We’re Up Against!

Miranda — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 21:12:39 -0000

Slightly sarcastic....but just ask anyone who's watched the show if the PUMA fanatics talking points are the stuff of Joss Whedon...watch them suddenly stop, ponder...and bust out laughing...I'm telling you Hillary is Buffy, Bill is Angel, Obama is the mayor of Sunnydale and hmmmm, I guess Michelle is Faith when she went bad and was working with the mayor.