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I love how she makes it seem like the black community is divided between Clinton and Obama.
Maybe she needs the reality check. The black electorate is far from divided when it comes to our decision. The real division is between the black electorate and our black officials.
Stephanie Tubbs-Jones points towards two families (the Jacksons and the Dysons) and wants to make it seem like there's a vast gender divide amongst black folk; Jesse and Dyson support Obama while their wives support Clinton.
Yet she conveniently ignores the fact that Hillary is consistently losing the overwhelming majority (I think 8/10) of black women voters. Black women are women too. And they, like black men, are overwhelmingly supporting Barack Obama. Not because he's black (although that helps) but because he has consistently had the more inclusive, more inspirational message.
Hillary's campaign was about Hillary before she got into trouble. Then her campaign was about feminism when it was convenient. Yet, as has been pointed out by many black women, the modern feminist movement has lacked in it's appeal to women of color because of it's focus on white, middle-class women. That's who Hillary has been speaking to. Not surprisingly, Hillary's strongest base of support is white women over the age of 50.
So the congresswoman should keep it real. The division is not between black men and black women. The division is between a black electorate who votes overwhelmingly for Obama while their elected officials back Clinton.
Now, Stephanie Tubbs-Jones wants to come on C-Span and mention black women's issues when it's convenient for her candidate.
Here's the sad part. Stephanie Tubbs-Jones admitted that she endorsed Clinton BEFORE SHE EVEN DECLARED HER CANDIDACY!
If anything, black folk ain't mad at her for choosing to support Clinton. We're just mad that she, like so many other "leading blacks," never gave Obama a chance. She, like so many other "leading blacks" were quick to line up behind the Clintons before this race even got started.
Now she and Tavis have the nerve to talk about accountability - when, by her own admission, she backed Clinton out of blind loyalty!
So spare me with the "poor CBC" crap. I don't condone sending death threats. But black constituents have EVERY RIGHT to call people like Stephanie Tubbs-Jones on her BS. We have every right to vote their butts out of office.
Congresswoman, don't talk to me about "respect" when I see you on the news, everyday, calling Obama an empty suit. Get real!!
Thanks, b-serious, for the Tubbs-Jones insight. Can anyone tell me what else I missed.
Again, Tavis has caused me to blow-up! After his supposedly "last commentary" on the issue of Obama not attending his self-serving Tavis Smiley presents "State of the Black Union", he goes on CNN to complain about Obama not attending. This guy just doesn't get it. Absolutely ridiculous! He barely registered a complaint regarding McCain and Huckabee not attending but I guess he felt that he should mention it to keep things fair in his mind.
During the first few minutes of the show, he utilized the time to support his so-called covenent. Does black america benefit financially from the sale of that book? Why doesn't he press the legislative branch to support the agenda? Any student of government knows that is where real change comes from. The president just controls the pulpit but Congress enacts change.
Did anyone hear Jesse Jackson address the critics who claim that hope is not important? It was amazing. I hope that someone posts it on Youtube.
I couldn't have said it bettery. Tubbs-Jones' propagandizing is off the chain.
Also, why is Tavis making this debate about himself. The majority of his comments have been realted to how black folk are throwing him under the bus for his suggestion that black americans hold Barack accountable. Not true. We are seeing through to his true intentions which are his divisiveness, "hateration" and desire to sell more books. Give me a break Tavis.
Can you imagine Barack up there trying hold himself out to the maintstream as President to all while rhyming and signifying with the panel? Dyson said it best when he said that Barack has to continue hollering to white folks while winking at black folks.
tune in. I loved the way Jesse Jackson politely told Tavis about himself and gave a shout out to Obama! Dyson had some great moments as well. All in all, I am enjoying
many of the speakers and their opinions. It will be interesting to see the reaction to Hillary in this setting and I cannot imagine
what in the world she can and will say!
I understand why some black elected officials supported Hillary over Barack. They grew up with the glass ceiling and saw Shirley Chisholm, Jesse Jackson and Douglass Wilder go down in flames. They doubted Obama was the one to shatter it. They are also party functionaries beholden to party leadership more than their constituents.
Still, how can they explain Obama trouncing Hillary in their own districts?
I do think Obama should have attended the Black State of the Union. He's been fearless in his candidacy thus far, no need to shy away now. I do wonder when Hillary arrives what will the youth crowd do? Will Hillary repeat her "Shame on you, Barack" comment from this morning?
We should, however, examine and opine why an elected official can support a candidate who loses in their own district by 70% margins.
We should highlight Billary's race-baiting in S. Carolina. We should pick apart Clintonian centrism that wears blackness in public but eviscerates (some) black folk in policy.
Like Al Shaprton just said, we welcome a "fair process" and a new generation of black voters have emerged to be the vanguard of a universal candidate.
We are not beholden to the Congressional Black Caucus, the civil rights groups, the Democratic Party, or the Clintons.
By the way, Sharpton just killed Jackson-Lee and Hillary supporters, saying now is not the time to stack the deck! Don't change the rules when we start winning!
BTW, Miss Ann threw a hissy fit today: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/23/clinton....>
1.) Sheila Jackson-Lee and Stephanie Tubbs Jones were sent with one specific goal. Advocate Hillary Clinton by using the issue of sexism as a tool to divide what's left of the black vote.
This is consistent with her use of identity politics to play one group off of another: blacks v. latinos; men v. women, etc.
You know, one thing that's been great about the Obama campaign has been the fact that he has not asked supporters to choose between race and gender. I look at an Obama rally and I see all types of people: men, women, black, white, etc.
These two Congresswomen have implied that black women should support Hillary because she is a woman. I, as a black man, obviously can't speak for black women. But I find it a little disingenous that now, when all else has failed, Hillary's camp is finally trying to bring sistas into the sisterhood.
2.) Don't trust your instincts. Tavis has pushed an argument that asks for accountability. Yet, his focus has been on questioning our overwhelming support for Obama. I find it troubling that people like Tavis continue to suggest that our support of Obama is emotional, superficial and not clearly thought out. It's like he keeps on asking us to rethink our support.
3.) Don't get your hopes up. Is it just me, or has anyone else been struck by the fact that Tavis has asked the following question at least 3 or 4 times?: How will you feel if Obama looses?
I'm sorry, but given the mathematics of proportional delegate allocation, and Obama's commanding lead and momentum - shouldn't he be asking that question of Sheila Jackson Lee and Stephanie Tubbs Jones?
4.) Buy my book! Tavis must have mentioned his book about 15 times in the past two hours.
5.) I agree. Al Sharpton just killed it!!!! Preach chuch!
Somebody please put that on youtube so I can paste it on my blog.
And the woman from Trans Africa. Anything else yall think I should pull?
At this point, I'm wondering if Tavis regrets having invited Hillary? Looking forward to seeing how she's received by the audience, Rev. Al and Dick Gregory.
Your points #1, #2, and #4 I agree with. The congresswomen were shameless Billary supporters. Did they forget Wisconsin? Barack is eating into her base. She's making zero in-roads into Obama's base.
Tavis is going to shuck that book until somebody reads it.
The idea that black folk pick candidates based on emotion has been a running theme since the 60s. Sadly, black folk believe it too. Yes, Tavis, we read the Washington Post and NY Times, we also listen to Democracy Now! and read The Nation and political blogs.
I disagree with #3. Tavis' question is legitimate. If Obama losses what will happen to all the Obamniacs? I've asked myself this a thousand times.
I would ask a follow-up, however, regarding how that loss occurs.
What if Obama loses the nomination via politricks (super-delegates, etc.)? Are we obliged to support Hillary? I think Tavis asks good question, just not enough.
Also, giving Hillary a stump speech at the panel discussion elevates her as more important that the other panelists. If the candidate cannot engage in the discussion they should not be given an unchallenged pulpit.
CINCINNATI -- Today, Hillary Clinton aggressively went after Barack Obama, criticizing him for playing similar political games to Karl Rove and at one point saying, "Shame on you, Barack Obama."
Speaking to reporters following a rally at a community college here, Clinton slammed Obama and his campaign for distributing mailings to Ohio voters attacking Clinton’s universal health care plan and her position on NAFTA.
“Today in the crowd I was given two mailings that Senator Obama’s campaign is sending and I have to express my deep disappointment that he is continuing to send false and discredited mailings with information that is not true to the voters of Ohio. He says one thing in speeches and then he turns around does this,” Clinton said waiving the two mailings at the cameras. ....
When asked about her new tone Clinton skirted the question going back to the mailings and attacking the Obama campaign for funding them.
“This election is about misleading, false and discredited attacks that interfere with voters being able to make an informed judgment,” she said.
Anybody who wants to continue to support her, can do so without me. I read a brother on another message board who said Harlemites should seriously consider not voting for Rangel next time. I think the same should be said for ALL of Hillary Clintons' supporters. This is madness, utter madness.
If it came down to Clinton versus John "i love lobbyists" McCain... I just wouldn't vote.
He elevated the conversation above the Hillary v. Barack debate. He addressed the group, which is what this panel discussion is all about --- black folk. We have to continually ask, what is the prize? I know it cannot be a one panacea superstar running for public office. We learned that with the influx of black mayors.
Still, it is about ushering the group into power not just to hold a seat but to make hard decisions. I am a cynic. Yet, I'm sure some loses and victories are ahead. Let's just fight for the latter.lo
Nita...
Youtube has the video....I think it's hilarious.
Regarding point #3:
I think it's pretty clear that Obama's supporters are not (and likely will not be) Hillary supporters should she win the nomination.
Obama's supporters who are not likely to vote for Hillary:
- Cross-over Republicans
- Independents
- Disenchanted Democrats that have left the Democratic Party
- First-time voters and youth voters. These are people who were brought into the process by Obama's campaign, NOT the DNC. They have no loyalty to the Clinton brand name. Their participation is based on the message, not the Party. . . their vote is based on principle.
Hillary's chances of winning the nomination fair and square are slim at best. The math is just not in her favor. I don't care if she wins TX, OH and PA. The math says that she has to win those states by landslide victories in those three states. Then she'd still have to basically run the table from there on out.
She's trying to set things up for a comeback based on perception. If she wins TX or OH by just one vote, she's gonna try to act like she's the new front-runner. And, sadly, the media is stupid enough to fall for it.
We might need Al Sharpton after March 4.
Tavis' question is only being asked because people know that the Clintons stepped in it when they went negative in South Carolina.
Personally, I will not be voting for Hillary Clinton. I'd rather support a third-party candidate or write in Obama's name.
BS line of the night:
"Don't worry about super delegates . . ." - Sheila Jackson Lee.
True Tavis should have also allowed Michelle Obama to speak so that Clinton's speech would not go unchallenged. But as my grandma would say, ain't nobody 'studdin' Hillary.
Why Blacks Should Consider McCain
She did say while responding to a question about whether or not Superdels should vote their constituent's hearts, that they should vote their conscience because they have more insight thant a voter would because of work that they have done together and relationships they formed while working.....
During this answer she further eluded to the fact that her pain was due to a lack of support from the black community.
Tavis kept acting like it was supposed to be a debate but you cannot debate with one person. She is knowing getting a stump speech??? I respect Tavis Smiley and his decisions but I feel that Michelle Obama should have been invited, I think that she would have been able to add a lot to the conversation. He was talking about Obama missing an opportunity but I think the SOTBU missed an opportunity by not allowing Michelle to say a could words. We are talking about the potential first black first lady here!
Nonetheless, I am a tad bit disappointed that the State of the Black Union this year sounds more like the State of the Election. Were there any other issues discussed?
I was out all day and couldn't watch the SOTBU. The comments are helpful thanks!
He was on a radio show last Sunday and they were asking him to ask her about her and her husband injecting race and their tactics. Did he even ask her that?
Or did she just test out her husband's dancing skills and came back to report?????????
Is she trying to play the victim card?? Oh please...
From what I've read here and observed over the last 2-3 weeks, looks like Tavis has sold his soul to the Clintons, especially if Hillary is given the platform to give a 'stump' speech without a place to ask her questions.
I just want someone to ask her a few questions.
1. Why was Marian Wright Edelman pissed off with you about the Clinton presidency stance on 'welfare reform'?
2. Why won't you release your tax returns and your White House papers when you were First Lady?
3. What makes up your 35 years experience and how were those years helpful to Black folk?
That is not accurate. Maxine Waters, Marcia Dyson, and others have also been strong Clinton surrogates on the trail and in the media. Most people get their news from local news and most of the advocacy has been with local news in each state. However, the two you named have also been vocal on CNN and MSNBC but never let it be said that Tubbs-Jones ever met a camera she did not like.
Tavis Please.
Morning session: VIDEO HERE
Afternoon session: VIDEO HERE
PS - God bless C-Span, am I right?
Did I miss the committee meeting? Was there a memo?
Who decided that if I don't vote along racial lines I'm a Mammy?
Perhaps you all are as myopic in your opinions as (you claim) Tavis and company to be?
I am black woman and I can only speak for myself. I truly believe that Hillary is the best person for the job, black or white, male or female, young or mature.
I accepted this UNTIL South Carolina, when they attemped to Dogwhistle Racebait Obama. Post South Carolina, sorry, I don't have respect for any Black defenders of Clinton.
IF a Republican had done to Obama what the Clintons did, the' usual suspects' would be up in arms.
Their silence speaks volumes.
BUt, I'll ask you.....how do you rationalize supporting someone who racebaited a Black candidate and continues to do so, with regards to Black and HIspanic voters?
We've been keeping track.
As for the comment about MLK made by Hillary (clutch the pearls), those were statements of historical fact. MLK did awaken the nation. He and the other leaders of the movement galvanized the community into action. He vocalized the ideal of what this nation should be in his actions and words.
MLK was not an elected official. He was not part of the legislature. He could not pass legislation. He could not enact legislation. it was LBJ who signed the CIvil Rights Act into law.
Do you really believe that the a majority of the politicians who voted for the Civil Rights Act did so because it was the right thing to do? Hell no. There was a lot of wheeling and dealing going on. It was LBJ's experience as a legislator that forced the issue through. He knew what branches to shake.
That's the point Hillary was making. That yes, we need advocacy but we also need experience players
to enact change. There was nothing racist about it.
In my opinion, it was the Obama supporters who racialized the issue.
Brother you are not authentic, just like so many others. I now understand why Tavis knew he could count on you to bust up Jesse's point and to defend those who took the wrong stand and were there begging us to not fire them. As Tavis said, "Thank you Dr. Dyson. Thank you for framing it like that for those of us who have been thrown under the bus. Thank you for breaking it down." Well I say, "Thank you C-span camera man. You may not have know exactly what you had in the frames of those shots but you had awakened me from a bamboozled moment. You exposed a pretender amongst us because I don't think I have seen a Black man grovel so much to the Missus since Morgan was Driving Miss Daisy."
I saw you Dyson and I am embarrassed that you above others felt you needed to lick those pumps. Do you and Tavis know something about some electronic vote tampering we can expect and you want to get in the cracked door now? Your speech in defense of Hillary and her supporters at the end of the morning wasn't lost on me because I saw it for what it was more plainly when I saw you bowing and scraping at her feet from one side of the room to the other. I shake my head as I type this. I always pay attention to the detail while everyone else is whooping and hollering on cue; the devil lives in the details.
If you think that, when I refer to Dogwhistle, race-baiting politics, that it has to do with the MLK/LBJ comments EXCLUSIVELY...
Sorry, Black folk aren't that ' sensitive'.
Click on the Wiki to the left of the blog. I do believe we've up to 40 such incidents.
1 - Wal-Mart (on whose board of directors Hillary sat while first lady of Arkansas) is sponsoring his mega-five-city (big $$$) museum tour.
2 - Bill Clinton is (shamelessly) hawking his latest book on Tavis's website.
3 - Tavis thinks his *movement* (The "so-called" Covenant) is more important than Barack's *movement* to be America's first REAL black president. If you recall, last year's SOTBU was marred, yes marred, by the attacks launched by the panelists (Jackson, West and Dyson spring to mind) against Obama -and supported by Tavis - BECAUSE on that same day Barack Obama was announcing his presidential candidacy in Illinois, rather than at their bullshit-psycho-babble-I-ain't-really-a-black-leader-but-I-play-one-on-TV fest.
For nine years, Tavis has insisted that he's our guide to salvation - if we buy his books. Frankly, as a dear friend pointed out, Tavis is like the guy at the laundromat selling socks from a garbage bag. Truth is, I've already got socks. And they'll be dry in 10 minutes. Don't try and sell me something I do not need.
Tavis is a loser. The Q&A; with Hillary was pathetic. He's definitely not a journalist. But he did spend the night at a Holiday Inn Express.
and Maxine Waters, John Lewis and all of these other folks who need to step aside but won't.
You've been a reader for some time?
So that means you're fine with the Dogwhistle/race-baiting politics pointed out on this blog by Rikyrah et al, that have turned many of us against the Clintons - many of us who, mind you, were NOT adverse to the Clintons prior to these insulting tactics:
* Clinton supporter Andrew Young says Bill Clinton is "blacker than Barack" because "he's probably gone with more black women then Barack".
* Clinton campaign official (and husband of former New Hampshire Governor and current Senate candidate Jeanne Shaheen) Bill Shaheen suggests Obama may have been a drug dealer.
** HRC made a point to apologize to Obama - in full view of cameras on the tarmac of some airport - after this incident. Shaheen stepped down after this incident.
* BET Founder Bob Johnson talks about "what Obama was doing in the neighborhood" (in a speech with HRC sitting right behind him.)
** After NO ONE bought his b.s. "I was talking about his community service excuse" Bob Johnson apologized for his comment.
* Clinton supporter Andrew Cuomo (son of former NY Gov. Mario Cuomo and current NY Atty. General) uses "Shuck and Jive" in reference to Obama.
** A politically sophisticated man born in 1957 uses the term "shuck and jive" casually? Oh sure...
CeCe
Nobody is putting anybody on a hit list because of their support for Hillary. For me, the reason that Waters, Jackson-Lee, and Tubbs Jones need to go is because of their undeniable failure to bring jobs, programs, policies, etc. they uplift and empower their communities. These folks have been in power too long to not have done more for their respective communities. The fact that they are supporting Clinton when their congressional districts overwhelmingly support Obama is for me the straw the broke the Camel's back so to speak.
1. I am shocked that you have the audacity to talk about Obama supporters but what Clinton Supporters are better?
I think a lot of people even whites and even people who did not support Obama felt that the Clintons were somehow injecting race. I never hated the Clintons and I still dont. Hillary is my junior senator. However I was very disappointed. In addition, I have been especially disappointed in the way in which she has run her campaign. It wasnt just one or two supporters or comments. It became a pattern. Do you see Senator Barack Obama's supporters tearing down Hillary, the way her supporters and surrogates have on issues that have nothing to do with policies at his rallies or in statements...I haven't. Hillary's campaign has been the one taking most of the cheap shots.
2. I'm sick of people attacking Obama supporters as if we make decisions based on emotion! We are passionate about Barack Obama's candidacy. I admire his fight for legislation and constant call for government transparency. I like how he wants to engage the American people in the political process. He is not a perfect man and I dont think that he has been or will be right on every single issue. He has even acknowledged that. I will apologize if you have encountered any Obama supporters that have been aggressive or unfair. I dont support that and neither does Barack. When we speak on this site, we speak based on facts. I cannot tell you how many blogs (whose writers and readers are mostly Clinton supporters)speak based on hate, false accusations, half-truths, prejudice. You could go look for them yourself, its easy to find...trust.me!! I had a professor compare Obama to Hitler in class (she's a Hillary supporter). A Good friend of mine was a Clinton supporter, she jumped ship. They drove her away.
3. We have no problem with constructive criticizism but when I hear what I hear too often about Obama being an "empty suit" I have all right to be upset.
4. We have all the right to hold our black leadership accountable. I have been waiting for this moment. I have no problem with them supporting Clinton, my mom does, but I have a problem with their denial and the way they act like black people owe the Clintons something.
5. As for the sax crap...why would you assume that I like anyone else on this blog actually fell for it. When people were cheering for Clinton playing the sax, I watched him throw Sister Souljah under the bus in order to please white sensibilities. I watched him refuse to even out the disparity between crack and powder cocaine. I watched him "reform" welfare. I watched more and more of my brothers go to jail under his administration. The gap between rich and poor got wider. I watched him step away from Jocelyn Elders, Lani Guiner and Marian Edelman Wright. I don't give a damn about the fried chicken and waffles dish, the soul food restaurant down the street named after him. I was appalled when people actually took seriously the idea of Bill Clitnon being the "first black president". I'm from New York, I grew up in the Bx. I dont care if Clinton has his office in Harlem. A lot of white people have their office in Harlem. It is one of the least expensive part of the city. They didnt choose to live in Harlem, they live in Chappaqua...two blocks down from my friend Rachel, in one of the richest towns in the state if not country. When I look at the Clintons, I look at what they have done. They have done good but they have also done things that have affected our community in a bad way. Let me not forget the atrocity in Rwanda. I cannot sit here and act like there were things that they did while in office that did not hurt our people.
6. Its not about whose evil its about whose frontin...ok.
7. "Shuck and Jive" and the idea of it...isn't something to take lightly. Try to make him look like a drug dealer or as someone who has been doing "something in the neighborhood" shouldnt be taken lightly and the list goes on. These tactics are old and they with many of the other tactics, have been used before against our people and they are not ok. Cece and Althea, don't look for me to defend you when your...NEXT!
I can't hold a candidate accountable for idiotic comments made by their supporters. If I did, I would have to vote for Ralph Nadar if Obama won the nomination.
Obama spoke out against war in Iraq. I'm glad he did but we don't know how he would have voted. 1) He did not enter the Senate until January 2005. The Iraq resolution was passed in October 2002. 2) He opposed the war but voted twice to continue funding to war.
So what are we to on by his speech or his actions?
He wasn't in the Senate yet BUT he was running to get there. He made that speech at a time when Bush had overwhelming public support and anyone who disagreed with the war would have been making a dangerous decision in terms of their longevity. Senator Lincoln Chaffee was fired as one of those who voted against the war.
Obama spoke out against the Iraq war IN SPITE OF the polling that showed he would likely lose the election as a result of a stand. He had the most to lose by speaking out then because he was likely to not get elected as a result but he put conscience before ambition. He trusted in the people of Illinois to recognize his honesty and his first rate character even when they disagree much like he is betting on the national electorate to see through your spin as a mignon of Hillary to choose the best candidate for the job and the one that most represents our values & goals.
OOO
See Official OBAMA "Hater Watch List (including Tavis)
Visit: www.Blacks4Barack.org
Obama News, Views, Issues (including Civil Rights), Photos, Volunteer Info and More !
Say It Loud...BARACK & I'M PROUD !!!!
I cannot not be weary of a candidate who counts on people's prejudices to win the nomination. In addition, her surrogates have all been very disrespectful of Obama in ways that I dont remember his being towards her.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IVy-w7CGz_w