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Tuesday Open Thread
i hate what is happening here and i am so fucking angry i can hardly bear it. i'm in tears half the time because of it all. we are destroying the world, we are destroying ourselves, we are barely hanging on in the 8th year of the most disastrous administration ever, and still people don't get it. none of it. it just seems so hopeless.
Instead of talking about Iraq they are bashing Wright/Obama.
Instead of talking about the Pentagon propaganda they are bashing Wright/Obama
Instead of talking about the price of gasoline they are bashing Wright/Obama
Instead of talking about the mortage crisis they are bashing Wright/Obama
Instead of talking about the Department of InJustice they are bashing Wright/Obama.
Instead of talking about the food crisis they are bashing Wright/Obama
Instead of talking about Sean Bell they are bashing Wright/Obama
When they bash Wright/Obama they are bashing all of us.
The Media can't do Sh*t for me.
Here is my email to all on air correspondents at MSNBC this morning. I would hope that will all join me in sending emails as well:
Some of you may know that popular PBS and radio commentator Tavis Smiley has been out of favor with a lot of black folks for what many of us consider unfair and unbalanced criticism of Senator Obama, but today I think he spoke as the voice of black America in asking why the hell hasn't the media held Pat Buchanan to the same standard as Reverend Wright? Why is it that a person who is part of the echo chamber that shapes opinion about presidential candidates not being taken to task for calling a U.S. Senator a race hustler and telling black folks we should be grateful for slavery because white folks saved us from our savagery and compensated our "free labor" with welfare and affirmative action. It is astonishing that this didn't offend every fair minded journalist and commentator in the country. The lack of outrage makes me wonder if any exist. The question has been repeatedly asked what does it say about Senator Obama that he stayed in Reverend Wright's church for 20 years...well, the same could be said about you all. What does it say that the same personalities who said nothing about the racist jokes and rants of their colleague, Don Imus, for years now is doing the same with another colleague, Pat Buchanan?
Even Keith Olbermann, while bashing Bill O'Reilly, Limbaugh and Hannity for their racial arson has said nothing about Pat Buchanan just as he, Tim Russert, Chris Matthews, Andrea Mitchell, David Gregory and others never said anything about Don Imus. Why is the media, mostly white, allowed to stand in judgment of Senator Obama and Reverend Wright but are not asked to withstand scrutiny?
Let there be no misunderstanding, I think Reverend Wright is an ass hole. He not only did a disservice to Senator Obama yesterday but the black church. As old black folks like to say, he showed his ass, but Reverend Wright's sins are no greater than Pat Buchanan's. Pat Buchanan with his perched position at MSNBC is as much a part of this campaign or more than Reverend Wright, so where is the accountability for him?
I've been asking this question for weeks, but now that Tavis has spoken maybe the question will finally be answered?!
Belle, I know it's easy to say, but ... don't despair. Things get awfully ugly before their real beauty is revealed. What you--really all of us--are seeing right now is a panic and fear that the status quo is changing, and that the defenders of the status quo are realizing just how little they can do about it. It might look bleak, but in reality, it's truly something to behold.
I'd say this, though: if you're still in possession of the power of love, joy and a sound mind, you're doing alright in life.
We've been told for centuries to pull ourselves up by our own bootstraps and play by the rules. Well, Senator Obama did that, and he is winning. And we're just lying back while there is serious discussion of taking this nomination away from him on some bull shit argument of electability.
Hell NO!!! I will march up and down the streets of D.C. and Denver, but they will not steal this from him without my voice being heard!
Obama has put his political career on the line defending this church and this man. Now Wright has shown himself to be nothing more than an egocentric, race hustler ready to sell books and capitalize on the controversy he has created. If Obama loses the nomination or the general election, you can bet that Wright will be right there, ready to make Obama the victim of all that he deems is wrong with America.
How could Obama be so naive? Or was he so blindly ambitious he took the fastest track possible to get what he wanted? Was he so confident and comfortable in his 'rock star' role that he thought himself to be impervious to scrutiny and scandal?
Obama's association with Wright has proved to be a debacle for him. A poor choice of pastor and mentor. He has been betrayed. This relationship has become toxic and it is time Obama walked away.
I personally do not hold Obama responsible for Wright's words but I also am unwilling to accept Obama's plea for understanding and 'context' of this man.
Obama needs to exercise some leadership, courage and good judgment and cut Wright loose.
This one act will demonstrate to voters who are skeptical about his lack of experience and his professed superior judgment that he has the character and fortitude to make the right decisions no matter how difficult.
Why should Barack take ownership of Wright's comment?
Why shouldn't the Pastor have the right to speak out against the people that attempted to demolish the man's 30 - 40 years of service to this country and his community because you don't like what he said in a sermon to his congregation?
Why shouldn't Pastor right defend himself?
Why should he wait until Barack completes the run for the Presidency?
This is bullshit and you know it.
If it wasn't Wright it would be something else. We know handing over the highest office in the land to a black man (even if he is half white) would not be an easy thing. It didn't matter what his experience were or his intellect or his background.
Anonymous talked about folks being
skeptical about his lack of experience and his professed superior judgment that he has the character and fortitude to make the right decisions no matter how difficult. I say BULLSHIT
What of Hillary's judgement to stay with Bill after multiple affairs, his lies to the American people and to her? What of her propensity to lie WITH A STRAIGHT FACE to the American people back to back without apologies until forced and it is a non-issue? What about her say and do anything to anyone as long as the results is to her advantage? What does that say about us as a people? I will tell you what it says to me -- it says you are all STUPID and deserve what you get.
Barack and Michelle will not suffer any hardship if this election is snatched from Barack. You know who will suffer? US the AMERICAN PEOPLE. All the people that for the first time thought they could make a difference and influence change in this election. The countries around this world are watching this election and for the first time in a long time thought of the US in a positive way and believed that it was in fact the land of the free and offered opportunities to ALL Americans.
We can't allow this crap to continue. We need to get together NOW and do something about this. We need to get the Black leaders to get involved. We need to get other minorities involved. We need all Americans of all races and colors who truly feel that it is time to tear down the barrier and double standards that exists between whites and other ethnic groups to stand with us. Because what is happening to Barack is certainly what will happen to all minorities who attempt to step across the line to get to what we thought as racial equality.
We need to slap them the heck back because I don't understand how even the black commentators are not speaking out against some of this crap that is happening in front of them. What can we do? Do we begin by calling the radio stations? Do we coordinate marches in Washington DC? Do we attempt to reach out the our leaders to address this issue today? The media is successfully drowning out the cries from the American people who are calling foul. An attack on Wright is an attack on ALL AMERICANS. Swiftboating Barack is the same as Swiftboating all minorities and we need a call of Action TODAY.
I know you are thinking. I am an angry black person. You bet your ass. We are not second class citizens. We need action now. If not for Barack . . . for all our children.
Maybe we should talk about that "electability" problem instead of focusing on the damn working class white voting block.
The good Reverend is a mixed bag. We need to move on.
So, keep you heads up.
For uplifting, check out my blog http://thisweekwithbarackobama.blogspot.com</br... is posted every Sunday evening or Monday, depending on what is going on in my life.
I will be in Indiana starting Friday, through Wednesday.
Again, let's keep out powder dry.
Peace out.
You know what I just noticed...Clyburn came out and made an explosive statement but I don't recall a single pundit asking a Clinton surrogate or Hillary about the feelings in the black community. However, they constantly ask Barack and his surrogates about the white vote. Has anyone seen the Clinton camp questioned about Clyburn's comments?
The media has been obsessed with Dr. Wright for months. The issue never died. While we may not appreciate his timing, he has been on the speaking circuit for 30 years. He is one of the most sought after theologians in the nation and he has every right to keep doing what he has been doing for all of his career.
The media's obsession with Dr. Wright is TRYING to destroy Senator Obama's campaign. The more we lament over the man's right to make a living the more power we give it.
I'm moving on. And think all of us should.
_____________________________________
Wright will forever be known first and foremost as Obama's former pastor, spiritual mentor and inspiration for the title of his book...
'I can not disown him...'
It is NOT evident that they are no longer associated.
Obama will now be pressed from the Left now, as well as the Right to repudiate Wright. if he does not, Obama is running the risk of being criticized as weak,ineffectual and showing poor judgment if he cannot stand up to Wright!
But, outside of HHH Faye Wattleton, without exception, the repeated line that I heard over and over again (Democrat and Republican) was:
Obama stood by Wright when it wasn't politically expedient, and Wright returned the favor by throwing Obama Under the Bus.
I heard that over and over again.
And, somehow, Wright's ' Book Deal' found its way into every conversation too.
DAMN SKIPPY!
Is Jeremiah Wright a colossal disaster for Barack Obama or a press trick?
In the eyes of the white ruling class, and much of White America, we are just a bunch of consumers who sing, dance, run, and jump pretty well.
All the significance of our presence here since 1619 is only of value to US. We are the only ethnic minority in this country who think that the dominant culture has some obligation to understand us. What a joke.
Afro-Carribeans come to this country with a history of Slavery, oppression, segregation, all of the above, but when get here they work hard, send their kids to college and move on without bitching about how people need to understand them.
Negroes need to understand why 50%
of their kids are dropping out of High School. Negroes need to understand why 70% of their kids are being born out of wedlock and fix it.
A culture of Bastards, Blunts, Babes, and Brew is destroying the Black community and we expect people to give a damn about what we mean to this country. I'll tell you what we mean to many Americans. A headache, an eye soar, and a problem. Jeremiah Wright just confirmed it.
This morning a whole generation of white kids who slavishly supported Barack are NOW THINKING ABOUT RACE FOR THE FIRST TIME. And you know what their thinking? Who is this IGNORANT NIGGA Jeremiah Wright totally messing up this campaign and potentially this country???!!!
And here we see a bunch of Negroes who want to cry Blame the Media. NO BLAME BARACK FOR BEING DUMB ENOUGH TO CHOOSE THIS GUY AS HIS SPIRITUAL ADVISOR! I know people who are in the Black church circles. Jeremiah Wright has been known for this kind of wild stuff for years. So Obama should have known better and forseen this. His naivte is amaturish and a valid reason to question his candidacy.
The fact that we tolerate the ridiculous statements of Reverand Wrights' in our community is more of a comdenation of the Black community then anything else. And PLEASE lets not act like he is the only Black pastor who acts like this. He is firmly within a tradition of that "institution" called the Black church...
You're delusional if you think the black vote is not significant to the Demcratic party.
If we choose not to vote, it would skew the election in a serious way.
Barack will not be derailed by his Pastor...and I don't have to DIMINISH Wright in order to DEFEND Obama.
America is still a free country where people have a right to their beliefs; the key question is will the country be more united or more divided. If you want the country to be more divided, then maybe Hillary is your candidate--you want a flame-throwing partisan in the White House, then "vote" for it.
I voted for a REAL Unifier, I intend to vote for the UNIFIER in November, and I expect the history books to say:
"Barack Obama is in that special class of Presidents: Washington, Lincoln, FDR...He is regarded as one of the Great Presidents of All Time because he 'EVOLVED' our political system."
Part of me wants Barack to start throwing punches too, but that's not his BRAND...not HOPEFUL and I have to remind myself, "Let Barack BE Barack."
Article on HuffPo that asks what happens if African Americans don't vote for Clinton in the general. Jack & Jill is linked in the article.
I read the article at HuffPo and I agree with the writer and add: it will be a cold day in hell before I support the Democrats with HRC as the nominee.
Futher, I saw where a HRC supporter organized the Press Club event. That's scary, do they think our anger will switch from HRC to Wright and we will blame him for hurting Obama instead of Billary? Well, I am not that stupid.
On, Wright, Wrong, and My African American Religious Experience
Instead of constantly lamenting, we need organization. A two fold plan to enact if A or B happens.
The issue is that the Clinton campaign and many others truly believe we (as in Black Americans) are DNC sheep that can be herded their way no matter who the nominee is come the General Election.
At the same time they also feel that the Hispanic vote is an offset to that and "more" important considering their numbers (and rising numbers).
Now the question is do we, as Black Americans, continue to be taken for granted and not considered "working class", not considered a viable part of the electorate? Do we continue to allow this society to define us by the most depraved among us?
Sorry if I'm not articulating myself as well as others here, I admit I may not be as well read as some of you, but I truly believe that this is about us.
We've allowed ourselves to be defined as Obama is now being defined now. Our brightest are considered exceptions and those many Working class black Americans that go out, keep their heads down, work hard, get by everyday and abide by the rules and law; are overlooked.
They are lost and defined by the thugs, addicts and murderers within the community. What other group does that truth hold with? ?No one with the exception of some of the Hispanic community.
It doesn't matter if Blacks from other countries come here and prosper, they are still defined in the same manner. They are only held up as examples for people like anonymous to use when it's convenient. The truth is, they are lumped with the rest of us as far as American society is concerned.
First we need a plan of action that starts from the ground up. Within the predominately black communities, to the mostly educated political blogosphere, straight to the American economy and finally to the political system.
We should work with those that are empathetic and share a commonality with us, like Puerto Ricans, Dominicans and ect.
So all this angst is best served with action and not later but now. Because even if the nomination is not robbed from Obama, we still have a General Election to get through.
There is a lot of work to be done. I'm just a normal person out here with tons of everyday issues to deal with but I'm sure some of the greater minds on this blog and other Black Blogs can get it together and we can all move forward in solidarity.
Let's take some action!
BTW, I'd be willing to send out letters, make calls to congress, organizations, advertisers or whatever needs to be done in that capacity.
Can Obama Appeal to White Rural Men?
Obama was supposed to unite the country, overcoming racial and even partisan divide.
That hardly seems to be the case now.
Wright is 'wrong' in word and deed. He is NOT, as he would love to be, the definitive embodiment of the 'Black Church.'
Black religious tradition is as diverse as the black community itself and I know many who take issue with his paranoid words and his egomania.
For weeks now Wright has insulted the United States, whites, Jews, Israel, Italians, et al.
All this will be fatal to Obama.
He should have expressed moral outrage at his pastor. Then, Wright would be gone and Obama would have recovered by now from any backlash.
"But the problem is that by contextualizing Wright, Obama has lost any high ground in commenting about race, and essentially given Wright a blank check to say what he wants without being “disowned”. Moreover, Obama’s politically expedient original embrace of Wright initially set a particular tone in the black community. Now, "a racist who lectures the NAACP about genetic brain differences is now canonized rather than jeered out of the hall."
I see this mess as tragic for the country, and a radical setback in our collective racial relations. Everyone of good conscience should deplore Wright in the strongest terms, and implore Obama once and for all to disown this extremist.
Everyone of good conscience should deplore Wright in the strongest terms, and implore Obama once and for all to disown this extremist.
Hate to tell you this.....but that won't happen.
You are missing the point.
Wright is 'wrong' to so many folks on so many levels. Looking at this through a partisan, political lens is missing the point.
If Obama has come out and denounced Wright as soon as the sermons became widely publicized, and claimed moral authority over Wright in a convincing, authoritative manner, some blacks would have been upset with him (the blow-back I discuss), but just as many would have agreed with his decision to separate himself with a man whose views are controversial and extreme.
His inability to stand up to Wright, call into question his ability to stand up decisively and firmly and act with strong leadership. Instead he tries to play it 'cool' and shrug it off as a 'distraction.'
His association with Wright has done damage to his campaign and his credibility.
N.C. Governor: Hillary's No "Pansy"
Citing Clinton's toughness, Mike Easley uses word seen as gay slur
And HOW does he "cut Wright loose"?
Does he have to kick his ass on national TV, ala Celebrity Deathmatch?
And even if he does the media will STILL bring it up.
I think Obama has done as much as HE can.
And talking about Wright isn't lowering the price of food or gas or stopping the War in Iraq.
Fuck the MSM!
I noticed that! Part of the narrative against Obama is that he's weak, that Hillary is more of a "man" than he is. The cheap shots about bowling. He's scared to debate...on and on. Unfortunately, this "pansy" comment doesn't go over well with gays.
You said -- His inability to stand up to Wright, call into question his ability to stand up decisively and firmly and act with strong leadership. Instead he tries to play it 'cool' and shrug it off as a 'distraction.'
Again - the fact that you don't understand this indicates a) you do not understand the black experience and b) you clearly are not an Obama supporter.
Your arguments don't fly. We ain't buyin it.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-sirota/clinton-criticizing-closu_b_98972.html
As China and India continue to increase the world wide demand for oil to fuel their growing economies are we going to ignore the natural resources and clean technologies such as nuclear energy that would allow us to achieve greater energy independence?
Politicians and special interests have made it nearly impossible to drill for our own oil or build nuclear power plants. Windmills, solar power, biofuels, while burgeoning alternative sources are not adequate to replace oil.
Any thoughts?
Michelle Obama on Rachel Ray
That should go over well in Charlotte, where she is currently leading in the polls.
Charlotte has a huge gay population, as does Winston-Salem. Wonder if they will be turned off by that? Gay men tend to vote in big numbers for Hillary Rodham Nixon.
Silly season to be sure.
Drill it. Dry.
It's a quick fix, and ultimately may lead us back to the same dependence on foreign oil....but by the time ANWR is dried up, I'm sure we will have created something better than fossil fuels for power.
Crabs in a barrel
There are no limits to the lengths Clinton and surrogates will go to insult groups of people.
Truthseeker
Thank you so much for that clip of Michelle Obama and Rachel Ray, it made me feel better. Rachel genuinely likes Michelle.
I don’t see any crimes or even misdemeanors in any of this. I do see civic activism and a concern for the welfare of children. The suggestion that something sinister was transpiring on those occasions is backed up by nothing except the four-alarm-bell typography that accompanies this list of entirely innocent, and even praiseworthy, actions.
Source
I don't think Obama has to cut Wright loose, Wright cut Obama loose.
I am seeing more of the clips from the Q&A; session - Wright really showed his ass.
They want a debate and they want it now.
Well you finally said something I could partly agree with. It's just a quick fix to nowhere. I do not think we should "dry up" the ANWR. Keep ruining the environment for a quick fix is not a solution but aiding a big problem that future generations will have to deal with and it will not be pretty.
All this for the sake of lining the pockets of oil companies (and if we are being honest we would all admit that's what it's all about.)
Invest in alternative energy and implement it...period.
it is a manufactured scandal. if it wasn't this it would be something else. remember they spent a week condenming his bowling.
they are bashing all of us!
tighten up and support!
Lawd a'mercy.
Tue Apr 29, 10:07 AM ET
WASHINGTON - Loyal Democrat Richard Somer says if Hillary Rodham Clinton gets his party's presidential nomination, he just may sit it out this Election Day.
what about the latte sippers and volvo drivers? i am sick of being insulted as well. first of all, i like cappucino and secondly i drive a kia. hillary clinton and the media deliberately insult my demographic group. how does she plan on winning without the cappucino crowd? what makes me "irregular"?
I think that a lot of the people who would complain about drilling ANWR are the same ones who think we're really in the Middle East for the oil (which is crap).
Dig our own oil; "end the war!!!" Should be a simple solution, if not for the environmentalists.
Everyone Else,
Hate to tell you, but your ship's taking on an awful lot of water. I bet Obama's a bit pissed at Wright, and it's going to come out soon (or maybe today, as Craig suggests).
McCain's not that bad, guys.
When Rush Limbaugh starts to make sense, the end of the world is nigh:
Rush on Wright & Obama
You took the words right from my thoughts!
Who would vote for someone an idiot like Bush would endorse - Bush is far more damaging than Wright could ever be.
Every time I watch Bush speak, I wonder how in the hell anybody could cast a vote for such an inferior mind and when I see McCain speak I'm reminded of Bush's inferior intellect.
D - Please!
Let's see here:
President Bush-Steered America through an attack on the level of Pearl Harbor. Led the nation into a successful operation to eliminate the Taliban in Afghanistan. Led the nation into an operation in Iraq based on shaky intelligence, but did bring freedom to millions of Iraqis nonetheless. Ultimately responsible-by authorizing tactics that not everyone agrees with-for preventing another terrorist attack on this nation since 9/11.
What does Wright have that compares to that?
And are you really going to try and sell the point that Bush endorsed McCain because they're lifelong friends? Bush would've endorsed WHOEVER the Republican nominee was. Republicans have a tendency to unite for a common cause, and not throw members of their party under the bus (like Clinton did Gore in '00).
"
D - You're joking right?
No, I'm actually serious....
He's human.
And he's doing the best he can with a terrible situation.
I hope this doesn't erode his support with his base.
We'll see.
He's saying today what he should've said in Philly.
I think Obama is over-explaining. He's having a conversation...with wolves. Obama looks sad and perplexed.
That is his Achilles heel.
Wright reminds me of the people who said he wasn't black enough. That because Obama is black he has to subscribe to every argument that Wright has.
Chris Matthews is saying that he didn't explain why he and the other good people of Trinity would listen to Wright.
Probably the same reason white folks who aren't prejudice grin and bear it when crazy white folks are speaking their anger.
Andrea Mitchell is schooling Matthews on the mixture of the church.
He also thinks the separation will hurt Barack with black folks. Little does he know, we don't like it when folks show their ass in public.
But so what.
Anybody that saw that can see how difficult that was for Obama.
Doubt it. Wright already put the target on Obama by saying he'd "come after" him if he becomes president.
I think history will record Jeremiah Wright as the person who single-handedly killed Obama's campaign. And God help the next African American that decides to run.
And it is sad, so many people spoke up on his behalf and he was fine until the Press Club appearance.
What a shame.
I agree.
IF he had done this when it initially came out, Black folk would have come down hard on Obama.
But, after what Wright did, we understand. Those that don't, got mad at Obama 'way back when' anyways.
If this turns into a I must have the last word verbal fiasco, Wright will lose.
Unless someone decides to exploit Wright's anger and offers him something he wants in order to sabotage Obama with direct and explicit political attacks.
Obama took a risk. He must know this can come back on him.
That's why I'd love to hear from Michelle.
If Obama will benefit from any "sympathy votes" it will happen next Tuesday.
He may also be hurt personally, but only because Wright said Obama was just another politician who was saying what he had to say to get elected.
That's right. Wright simply echoed and reinforced all of the previous comments he has made, and Obama is the last man to realize just how toxic he is.
And this man wants to negotiate with Ahmajenidad, et al.
Oops. "The man I met with is not the man who today nuked Isreal."
Sad. Too little. Too late.
Fucue!
Craig, Rikyrah, Truth
I hope Trinity will still support Barack.
I think the MSM will swoon and cover for Obama like they did after his Philly speech.
Supporters and the MSM will claim to be just as taken in as Obama was, and now 'understand.'
Wright believes everything he says, and apologized for none of it.
He also said that Obama is just a 'politician' who is saying what he needs to say to get elected.
That's why Obama is denouncing him now. Purely political, desperate move.
I'd like to hear from Michelle too. I wish they had done that press conference together.
Wright suggested that the opposition to his comments were not about him but an attack against the black church. Therefore, the implication is that if Barack responds against him, Barack is attacking the black church. It is vitally important for black church leaders come out and support Barack's position.
I agree and hope that they come out and support him.
There are two really good stories at the Root.com about Wright and how he was wrong and the possibility that he is working with someone else to sabotage Barack's campaign.
After PA, it became apparent to everyone there was no possibility of Hillary catching up in delegates. The Presidency is slipping from her grasp and she will be forced to take more extreme measures to get the nomination. Her surrogates try to stall superdelegates from making their choices so as to buy time for Hillary to plot and scheme. Each time she loses they go on TV and start fast-talking about how we should let all the states vote.
The Obama campaign has got to be vigilant! If he thinks Bill & Hillary are going to give up power and wealth that easily, he's sadly mistaken. If Barack thinks he won't have to fight them, he better wake up!
Obama has to be more ruthless in protecting himself now. He's got to figure out a way to do it on the down low.
Hillary Rodham Nixon takes more money from lobbyists than any candidate who ran for president this cycle.
Speaking truth to power.
The 50 most influential US political pundits
She might be behind that, but it's not going to happen.
Wright suggested that the opposition to his comments were not about him but an attack against the black church. Therefore, the implication is that if Barack responds against him, Barack is attacking the black church. It is vitally important for black church leaders come out and support Barack's position.
He clowned; if the NPC was the ONLY point of reference with regards to Wright, it would be one thing. But, it's not. At all. And that's why, at least, THIS Black woman is pissed, because it had to be ON PURPOSE.
The MSM is deliberately conflating the two men. Then again the MSM believes black people in America (or worldwide) are fiendish co-conspirators and a monolith.
Hah. If only....
Link here: Dukasis offers Obama advice on how to win the GE. He expects him to get the Dem. nom.
At this point that is all that matters: close out the Dem. nom. and onto the GE.
Has Obama, by default, disowned the black community, since he made the two inseperable?
And I hear Wright has a book coming out in October...
I wish he could throw you under the bus.